Below is a copy of the actual report card we received for our child (sorry for the poor quality!). I whited out the grades for obvious reasons and I’m not sure if all schools use the same report card, but this will give you an idea of how children in a G&T kindergarten class are evaluated. The grading scale is 1 to 4, with 4 being “exceeds grade-level standards” and 1 being “far below grade-level standards.”

I sat on the G&T panel and answered questions from prospective G&T parents. Along with three other parents, there were also two teachers on the panel — one who teaches gifted and talented students and another who actually proctored the OLSAT and BRSA tests for several years. Bige Doruk, founder of Bright Kids, gave a presentation beforehand.

About 40 parents attended the session scheduled from 6:30 to 8 p.m. After it was all said and done we didn’t get out of session until after 9 p.m. due to the high interest and interaction amongst audience members! The participation levels were extremely high especially in the area of OLSAT and BRSA test prep. I was bombarded by questions from parents during and after the session due to my personal experience with gifted and talented program at PS 33 Chelsea Prep, which my child attends.

This session provided a true forum for parents to find out the “ins and outs” of the OLSAT and BRSA tests and how to navigate through the NYC gifted and talented program admissions process effectively. Due to the setting and content of the meeting I’d have to say this information session was far better than the DOE NYC gifted and talented information session I attended. I think the more intimate setting of this session provided the atmosphere prospective parents of G&T students needed to get their questions and concerns answered.

In previous postings I wrote about the top 10 things the DOE should do to improve gifted and talented information sessions and also my personal experience while attending the gifted and talented information session in Manhattan a couple of weeks ago.

I’d like to hear from Gothamschools readers about gifted and talented information sessions for parents. Are the sessions necessary or should content on the internet and the DOE web site suffice?

1. There should be a “first come, first seated” policy on seating. When it’s full don’t allow anyone else into the session.
2. Make sure the facility doesn’t get too hot. Parents are already on edge to begin with so the heat during the Manhattan session last week just added to anxiety levels.
3. Start the gifted and talented information sessions later than 6:30 p.m. Many people work until 6 or 7 p.m. so getting to the school in time for the G&T information session by 6:30 p.m. could be difficult for some.
4. Present additional information about the gifted and talented program that people wouldn’t be able to get online.
5. Distribute FAQs at the beginning of the meeting so parents can review those questions and answers during the presentation.
6. Hold audience Q&A at the end and have people line up on the side for their questions. There should be a microphone to speak into so everyone can hear the questions instead of the presenter shouting and repeating the question to the audience.
7. For any answers available online refer parents to online instead of addressing those questions.
8. Conduct more gifted and talented information sessions in Manhattan and other boroughs.
9. Allow parents who have gone through the gifted and talented testing process with their children give a presentation to the audience.
10. Have the information session as a live webcast or taped webinar. Many people have small children at home and can’t find babysitters during weekdays.

If you attended one of these sessions (or even if you did not), I am interested to know what you think: How could these sessions be improved?

Parents leaving in masses during the middle of the presentation due to the heat and crowding.

As I trotted into the auditorium with my camera swaying around my neck the presenter from the DOE gave a PowerPoint presentation to the audience. I didn’t catch her name since I showed up late for the session. The flow of the presentation seemed a bit choppy as audience members randomly shouted out questions with really no crowd control in place for the questions. Finally the presenter told everyone to keep their questions to the end of the presentation and the crowd gave a small ovation to the request.

Parents listen intently and try to get answers to their many questions.

I have to admit I was a tad bit disappointed with the session because of the set-up (especially the heat!). I think the DOE tried to make the session informative but probably didn’t expect this type of response from so many attending. This was the only information session held in Manhattan and it might have been good to have another information session in Manhattan that would be easier for parents (like me) who live below Houston Street. Luckily, I’m in a position where I know most (if not all) of the information shared at the session due to my experience with the gifted and talented program here in New York but most who attended probably are not. I did sense a bit of frustration from parents at the session who seemed to be new to the NYC gifted and talented extravaganza and all of its little intricacies like OLSAT and BRSA testing criteria.

Here are a few of the comments parents told me about the Manhattan information session for G&T:

“All the information they shared is already on their Web site and I really didn’t find out something I already knew.”

“I didn’t realize there were so many people in Manhattan interested in this program. This seems very competitive.”

“I had a specific question about transportation but they never answered my question.”

On the upside, the DOE did have three representatives in the lobby outside the auditorium to answer questions from parents one-on-one. The DOE printed copies of the G&T handbooks that are available online. I didn’t see many parents take the books but I assume most probably downloaded it themselves prior to the meeting or possibly picked up the handbooks at the beginning of the session prior to my arrival. There were also people from Bright Kids NYC outside of the school promoting their OLSAT test prep service to prospective G&T parents.

I also received updates from parents who attended the NYC gifted and talented program information sessions in Queens and Brooklyn. Here are the comments from those sessions:

From parents who attended the G&T information session in Queens:

“Since the info session answered most of my questions, but not all, I’d rate it at an 8 out of 10.”

“The crowd certainly reflected the diversity of Queens and every ethnic group was represented.”

“The presentation was centered around the application process and enrollment, but not the program itself. When asked about the benefits of the program itself they only pointed out the benefit of having a classroom full of high achievers.  They also stated that it was up to the individual teachers to modify and adapt the program to meet the needs of gifted children.   They encouraged parents to contact the schools directly to find out more about the individual programs.”

“The high school auditorium was packed with people standing. Many people brought their children with them, which surprised me because I was expecting a room full of parents.”

From parents who attended the G&T information session in Brooklyn:

“It was pretty crowded, but given the number of parents in Brooklyn with kids I was surprised they were only having one meeting per borough.”

“I would say it [the information session] was useful because you got most of the essential information, deadlines and dates, the basics about the two tests, the procedures and processes about applying for the test and then maybe subsequently a G&T program, the differences between district programs and Citywide programs, etc.”

Overall, I think the NYC gifted and talented program information sessions provide useful information for parents who want specific questions answered beyond what they can find out from the DOE web site. I admire the DOE for conducting such sessions in each of the five boroughs.

In my next post, I’ll give my list about how the DOE can improve its G&T information sessions. For now, I’d like to hear from other parents who attended one of the G&T information sessions. Were the sessions useful? Would you recommend these sessions to other parents?

And here are more pictures from the information session I attended:

The presenter from the DOE gives parents information on G&T program

Outside the presentation, representatives from the DOE answer parents' questions about G&T.

Stacks and Stacks of gifted and talented handbooks courtesy of the DOE during the information session

Bige Doruk, from Bright Kids NYC, talks to prospective G&T parents about her OLSAT test prep book offered by Bright Kids NYC.

Yes, that’s a loaded question and depending on whom you ask you’ll probably get a different response from everyone.  I’ve heard G&T defined by some parents as “every child is gifted and talented” while other parents claim “only the top 1% of the top 1% (.0001) are considered gifted and talented.” My guess is most people define gifted and talented somewhere in between.

As far as the NYC goes, the DOE defines gifted and talented extremely narrowly: by OLSAT and BSRA scores alone. Is this fair? Is it accurate? Aren’t some children artistically or physically gifted in ways that would not show up on the OLSAT, ERB or Stanford-Binet tests? That’s a valid point but the NYC DOE must define this program somehow, some way. No matter how the DOE chooses to define gifted and talented the critics will come out of the woodwork.

Then there’s the whole naming of “gifted and talented.” Is that really the most appropriate label for such a program that is solely based upon two tests given to a youngster (and in some cases a toddler!) by a complete stranger? Yes, there needs to be some sort of naming convention for the program but how about something like “advanced learners” or “academically inclined” or “children of obsessed parents trying to get their child into the G&T program”? Maybe something that sounds a bit less pretentious and a smidgen more inclusive.

I have to admit when I tell people my child got accepted to the gifted and talented program there’s a little bit of ego (ok, a lot of eg0) and pride when I speak on the topic. After all, it’s all about me — right? Wrong. So, is “gifted and talented” really meant to describe the student or just be a good descriptor to boost a dad’s ego? Being a proud father of a gifted and talented student as defined by the NYC DOE I must admit … well, let me think about it for awhile.

I’d like to hear from other GothamSchools readers on how they define (or despise) the label “gifted and talented.” Should we use another name? Should NYC have yet another private school that caters to the gifted and talented like Speyer Legacy School?

NYC Gifted and Talented Information Session Reminder Postcard

In the mail yesterday we received the notice below from the NYC DOE reminding us about the gifted and talented program information sessions that began yesterday in the Bronx. I’m sure there were many parents in the Bronx who would have liked to attend but didn’t get their notice until it was too late. Hopefully those parents can attend the sessions in the other boroughs over the next week.

Here’s the question I asked: Would you tell anyone if you prepped your child for the OLSAT test for gifted and talented program?

And here are the results I found:

• 56% - If someone asked, I’d be more than happy to tell them but I wouldn’t broadcast it.
• 17% - I would never test prep my child for the OLSAT under any circumstances.
• 11% - I would tell absolutely no one - I want others to think my child is gifted without prepping!
• 11% - I would tell pretty much anyone - why hide it?
• 6% - I would only tell my closest friends and absolutely no one else.

I’d like to hear from GothamSchools readers if they’d tell anyone if they prepped their child for the OLSAT test. Remember, we’re talking about a 128-question test for a 4 year old to get into G&T kindergarten and  a 148-question test for kindergarteners to get into G&T first grade.

The principal stood before us and explained the expectations of parents for the gifted and talented program. I have to admit, the expectations are extremely high for parent involvement but I prefer that than low expectations. Principal Lindy told us about the aggressive math and reading curriculum along with the levels our kindergartner will be expected to learn. The principal went on to tell us she secured a special instructor in robotics for the students! The school scheduled a robotics expert to come into the class on a regular basis to teach the children the fundamentals of robotics. Each child prepares their own project to learn the mechanics and creativity of robotics. Needless to say, we were shocked (in a good way) this type of experiential learning will be available for our kindergartner.

The primary G&T teacher then explained the reading exercises we need to do with our child on a daily basis after school and on weekends. She really promotes writing as the foundation to create a strong reader. We then received a math workbook to take with us to do “real life” math projects with our child at home. I really appreciate the approach the teacher takes by integrating real life experiences in the learning process for our child and by always making the learning experience fun, interactive and creative!

Even after a few short weeks we are still amazed at the progress our kindergartener has made. Every morning our child runs out of bed to read books and the other day wrote 2 picture stories prior to going to school. All of this without any prompting from us. The creativity in the learning has impressed me to no end and so far the G&T teachers at PS 33 are simply amazing! Please remember, I went into this program with extremely high expectations.

I’d like to hear from GothamSchools readers to see how they are doing so far this school year with their child’s G&T program.  I’ve journaled my whole experience with PS 33’s G&T program on my blog (non-GothamSchools) since we selected the school this past spring.

I’ll be attending a couple of the sessions to evaluate the format and gauge interest in this program. I’ll post my evaluations of these meetings and I invite you to do the same.

Here’s a brief summary of the upcoming dates, taken from the DOE’s site:

For GIFTED AND TALENTED APPLICANTS who were BORN in 2005, 2004, 2003 & 2002,
i.e. for K, 1st, 2nd, & 3rd grade placement in the 2010 - 2011 school year.

The deadline to submit a Request for Testing (RFT) form to test your child for a Gifted & Talented Program is FRIDAY, NOVEMBER 6, 2009.

January 4 - February 26, 2010
OLSAT/BSRA testing at school sites for public school students

January 9, 10, 23, 24, 30 & 31 and February 6 & 7, 2010
OLSAT/BSRA testing at selected sites for non-public school children

October 14 to October 22 - Families are invited to attend an information session about NYC public school Gifted and Talented programs. All sessions will be held from 6:30pm to 8:00pm.

• Bronx -Roosevelt Campus, 500 East Fordham Road, Bronx, NY 10458 - Oct. 14 6:30pm
• Brooklyn- MS 113, 300 Adelphi Street, Brooklyn, NY  11205 - Oct. 19 6:30pm
• Staten Island -New Dorp, 465 New Dorp Lane, Staten Island, NY  10306  - Oct. 20 6:30pm
• Queens - Long Island City HS, 14-30 Broadway, Queens, NY  11106 - Oct. 21 6:30pm
• Manhattan - Brandeis, 145 West 84 Street, Manhattan, NY  10024 - Oct. 22  6:30pm

Additional details and information are posted on the NYC DOE site.

I recently took a survey on my (non-GothamSchools) blog to find out the general sentiment toward test prepping a 4-5 year old for gifted and talented programs. Here are the results from the question: What type of tutoring and prep for NYC gifted and talented testing is appropriate for 4-5 year olds (pre-k to kindergarten)?

 47% — A solid combination of tutoring experts for NYC gifted and talented programs along with parents’ heavy involvement in the tutoring as well.

27% — Parents should be the only tutor or prep giver for the NYC gifted and talented testing at the ages of 4-5.

20% — Let the children play! There should be absolutely no test prep for a 4-5 year old for NYC gifted and talented testing.

7% — Only tutoring experts specializing in NYC gifted and talented testing who have a proven track record of success.

After reviewing the survey results from my blog I thought it would be interesting to hear from GothamSchools readers about test prepping 4-5 year olds for the NYC gifted and talented program. So, should we or shouldn’t we? Now be truthful!

Since our child (at the ripe age of four) took the 128-question OLSAT/BSRA test (yes, 128 questions!) in February and got accepted to a public school gifted and talented program, I’ve become quite familiar with the ins and outs of the G&T program from a parent’s perspective. Between the OLSAT testing, obsessing, waiting on the results, obsessing some more, receiving the test results, touring the the G&T schools, obsessing again, prioritizing the schools we wanted, receiving the school placement letter from DOE, going to parent orientation, and finally having the first day of school it’s been quite a ride! 

Now I want to share my expertise as I continue to learn more. On my blog I’ve chronicled (step-by-step) my experiences with the NYC gifted and talented program since we received our child’s OLSAT test results and acceptance letter in May. Going forward, I’ll post information like that both here and on my own blog. I am excited to open up a discussion about the city’s gifted and talented programs with GothamSchools readers, so please e-mail me with your questions, comments and experiences.

Although we’re just three weeks into the school year we’ve been very pleased with the results we’re seeing with PS 33’s first year of G&T. From the teachers to the parents to the principal there’s a real team approach to the success of our child’s education. We’ve been able to integrate what’s learned in the classroom into activities we can do at home with our child on nights and weekends. So far, so great!

P.S. — In case you’re not familiar with how stressful (and competitive!) this process can be, watch this short video that shows three New York City families who are “Getting in … Kindergarten.”