Comments on: Union: City is the reason, not the solution, for teacher shortages

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By: Norm

Norm — Tue, 23 Oct 2012 04:19:00 +0000

Did anyone fact check this: Overall teacher attrition is actually down 50 percent since the time
Bloomberg took office a decade ago, according to department spokeswoman
Erin Hughes said.
Using the figures cited in the article: Of the 6940 teachers hired that year (2006-7), 38.9 percent have left the system,
according to data provided by the UFT. That rate increased to 50
percent for teachers of Science, English and English as a Second
Language.
So Erin Hughes is saying in essence that before Bloomberg the number leaving the system in this time frame was 50% higher. I was still teaching in those years and no one was leaving like today. Using “facts” tossed out by DOE officials without showing some connection to reality — like why not include numbers from the pre-Bloomberg years? – offers flacks an opportunity to make up anything they want. I guess not being able to unhinge Mulgrew’s numbers that had to go to Plan B.

By: Mr. Flerporillo

Mr. Flerporillo — Sun, 21 Oct 2012 22:41:00 +0000

Just noting what seems like a pretty similar state-of-the-profession. Maybe it’s worse today, but the trend seems consistent. And the labor market in the early 80s was terrible.

By: Vote NO!

Vote NO! — Sun, 21 Oct 2012 21:38:00 +0000

The 1980s were NOTHING like it is today. They are trying to run all of the teachers out of the profession. Young teachers are terribly discouraged, and veteran teachers are under “attack”. Teachers are quitting, and retiring during the school year. That hasn’t happened in such numbers since the chronic shortage days of the 1990s. This is detrimental to the students, as it disrupts their education during the year. Replacement teachers aren’t usually available the “next day” and the students often lose days, even weeks of instruction as the administration tries to get someone to replace the teacher that left. In an effort to “get the teachers,” and establish a cheap labor force, many kids in NYC are being denied decent instruction, from good teachers.

I must agree with Mulgrew. Things would be a lot worse if the labor market wasn’t so bad. If the labor market improves, NYC will be facing a teacher exodus.

By: Mr. Flerporillo

Mr. Flerporillo — Sun, 21 Oct 2012 12:53:00 +0000

Mike, is that you?

By: Guest

Guest — Sat, 20 Oct 2012 20:23:00 +0000

funny, i got the exact same advice from my father (guidance counseler) around that same time when i was entering college. makes you wonder when the golden age of public education really was, if it ever actually existed at the primary and secondary school levels.

By: Pogue

Pogue — Sat, 20 Oct 2012 09:38:00 +0000

Thank you, Flerp. As a teacher, I just love looking at data on a computer outside of school. It gives me a break from looking at data on a computer inside of school.

By: Guest

Guest — Sat, 20 Oct 2012 06:16:00 +0000

I walked off my teaching position, because my Principal made my job literally impossible.
Thank God I was retirement age, and contributed 25% of my pay to my TDA for years.
I annuitized that sum, and now have enough to live on for the rest of my life.
All we have going for us now is our 7% TDA (which Doomberg lowered from 8.25% when he got illegally re-elected), so make sure you’re fully invested (26% of your salary), because in four years, we’re even going to lose that.
Doomberg and his gestapo of principals have made a nightmare out of what was once an honorable profession.

By: Mr. Flerporillo

Mr. Flerporillo — Sat, 20 Oct 2012 01:41:00 +0000

This (written in 1983) is pretty much what his view was:

Just as serious as the problem of teacher competence is the state of the teaching profession. Some teachers insist bitterly that teaching is no longer a profession, but has been reduced to a civil service job. Other professionals are subject to entry tests and to supervision by senior professionals, and they usually retain a large measure of control over where they work and how they perform their duties; in teaching, governmental agencies and policymakers have bureaucratized hiring practices. curriculum development, student evaluation, and other areas that once engaged the experience and participation of teachers. The effort to make schools “teacher-proof” ends by making the teachers technical functionaries, implementing remotely designed policies. With so many laws and regulations and interest groups on the scene, wise teachers look for protection to the rulebook, their union, their lawyer, or to some job with more dignity. For the person who simply wants to teach history or literature, the school has not been a receptive workplace.

In response to declining enrollments and worsening working conditions. the number of people who want to be teachers has dropped sharply over the last decade. The number of undergraduate degrees awarded in education reached a peak of 200,000 in 1973. when they were 21 percent of all bachelor’s degrees awarded in the nation. but dropped to only 108,000 in 1981, fewer than 12 percent of all bachelor’s degrees awarded. The tight job market has meant not only a decline in the number preparing to teach, but a decline in the ability of those who want to teach. Apparently the brighter students were smart enough to pick another field, and the flight of academically talented women to other fields has particularly depressed the quality of the pool of would-be teachers

By: Mr. Flerporillo

Mr. Flerporillo — Sat, 20 Oct 2012 01:34:00 +0000

He’s a great guy. Was my baseball coach, too. But he advised against becoming a teacher for the same reasons you do now.

By: Pogue

Pogue — Fri, 19 Oct 2012 23:40:00 +0000

Did your neighbor’s father have a pension, and did you resent him for it, too?

By: Juggleandhope

Juggleandhope — Fri, 19 Oct 2012 18:53:00 +0000

Given the obsessive focus from the DOE to make veteran teachers more replaceable (attempts to eliminate tenure, teacher evaluations reliant on test scores, opposition to Last-In-First-Out, firing 50% of teachers at “turn-around” schools) it does seem worrisome to give that same DOE the power to credential however many replacements it chooses.

By: Michael Fiorillo

Michael Fiorillo — Fri, 19 Oct 2012 18:13:00 +0000

Fox, meet henhouse.

By: BloombergMustGo

BloombergMustGo — Fri, 19 Oct 2012 16:16:00 +0000

“Can 80,000 teaching educator professionals ALL BE WRONG??”

Acccording to Bloomberg, yes, because we are all incompetent.

All kidding aside, thank you for voicing what every teacher in this city, and probably the country, is thinking. Astounding how we all made it through Bachelor’s, Master’s, and more, have taught for many years, produced many well educated individuals before Bloomberg et.al. came along to tell us how stupid we are.

By: Nyr683

Nyr683 — Fri, 19 Oct 2012 13:30:00 +0000

I am a teacher and currently I do not know of one OR ANY teacher or any other educator in our system who agrees with ANYTHING the bloomydoe does…..The question then is ( Can all of us be wrong?? Can 80,000 teaching educator professionals ALL BE WRONG??

By: Mr. Flerporillo

Mr. Flerporillo — Fri, 19 Oct 2012 13:30:00 +0000

“I used to recommend teaching as a fruitful, altruistic, and worthwhile profession to my students for many years…

I no longer do.”

I remember my neighbor’s father saying the same thing thirty years ago.

By: Nyr683

Nyr683 — Fri, 19 Oct 2012 13:26:00 +0000

its just another bloomydoe idea at work again with no thought and reckless abandon…..

By: Jason

Jason — Fri, 19 Oct 2012 12:14:00 +0000

We have a new principal this year. The ‘Gotchas” are off the charts! This person is alienating everyone, even the office secretaries. It’s so sad to see a good school getting this kind of treatment. People are already talking about jumping ship, and two have already, even though it’s only the second month of school. We had almost zero turnonver prior to this new leadership academy ‘gotcha’ expert.

By: A.S.Neill

A.S.Neill — Fri, 19 Oct 2012 10:01:00 +0000

anyone teaching for some time will recognize the truth of this assessment. this semester several teachers at my school have already just walked off the job even given the state of the economy. exceptionally competent or ambitious teachers angle to move up to administrators, transfer out of the troubled schools to “better” schools or another city or state, or just to better occupations entirely (“teaching as peace corps” stepping stone). the working conditions are truly atrocious as Milo points out. much of it is the quality of many students of course, but the tipping point is usually the administration which is exceptionally ham handed in providing support backed up by the ideology of teacher blame for all the ills of education. add in removal of tenure and union protections, and you will devastate the stability of the teaching civil service. each “crisis” in education sets the stage for the next “crisis” 5-10 years down the road, and so it will be this time also. funny how people can be so blind.

By: Pogue

Pogue — Fri, 19 Oct 2012 09:31:00 +0000

I used to recommend teaching as a fruitful, altruistic, and worthwhile profession to my students for many years…

I no longer do.

It has become a micro-managed, data-run, minutiae-driven, time-consuming, demoralizing occupation.

Again, thank you Obama, Duncan, Bloomberg, Cuomo, King, Gates, Walton, ALEC, Weingarten, Iannuzzi, and Mulgrew.