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wrapping around

October 4, 2012

For the first time, guidance counselors join ATR rotation system

by Rachel Cromidas, at 9:25 am

Most teachers without permanent positions are looking forward to a greater chance of stability after the city and teachers union last month agreed to place them in long-term substitute slots before rotating them to different schools weekly, as happened last year.

But the 300 guidance counselors and social workers in the Absent Teacher Reserve are gearing up to begin cycling from school to school for the first time.

Last year, even as other members of the ATR pool, the group of educators whose positions have been eliminated, began the rotation system, the counselors were assigned to a single school so they could work with individual students for extended periods of time. But starting next week, they will be assigned to different schools each week, dramatically changing their roles and responsibilities.

Instead of working with students one on one, the counselors will take on shorter-term tasks, city officials said. The tasks could include making classroom presentations on graduation requirements, conflict management, and the college or high school application process; organizing records; supporting the school’s college counselors; and reviewing student schedules at the start of the semester.

Coming at a time when many schools have trimmed support services because of budget cuts, the change has some educators and researchers raising their eyebrows.

“All the counselors I have talked to are very adamant that what’s very important is regular meetings and keeping up with students,” said Randall Reback, a professor at Columbia University who has researched the roles counselors play in schools.

“I think rotating at different points in the school year would be very detrimental to that,” he added. “It’s not like you can just pinch hit and have a different person show up and expect to make progress, because it’s very much about developing that relationship and trust.”

But others said the rotation system is better than nothing for schools that would otherwise go without a counselor this year.

“A school might not have the money to hire an ATR,” said City Councilman Robert Jackson, the chair of the council’s education committee.

However, Jackson said the weekly rotations would make it difficult for the counselors to work with students without taking detailed notes for the next person to pick up. Though imperfect, he said that set up would be preferable to having the counselors conduct only administrative tasks, because “It’s better to be working with students than sitting in the ATR pool.”

When city and union officials agreed to the rotation system in June 2011 as part of a deal to avert teacher layoffs, they both said the goal was to cut spending on substitute teachers and expose teachers without permanent positions to multiple principals who might hire them.

Although teachers in the pool criticized the rotation system for unfairly stigmatizing them and preventing them from making use of their expertise as educators, union and city officials have both said the system had resulted in hundreds of teachers exiting the pool for permanent positions.

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  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100002397245457 Mary Conway-Spiegel

    A good guidance counselor who’s on-site, embedded and knows his/her community is invaluable…it truly is possible for public education in NYC to get worse.

  • Mikkemaden

    when will the insanity end!!!!please end this insanity new mayor please

  • mikke madden

    schools would be left to go the entire school year without a guidance counselor!!! why not the city is paying them anyway!!!!cmon, please where are some people with sense in this system

  • Mikkemadden

    nycdoe should really think about it….why pay a counselor to sit around somewhere in some school and do nothing and  still get paid, and let a school go all year without a guidance counselor!!!! because they dont have it in their budget….lol…you cant make this up,,,i hope the new mayor reads this

  • I noticed that…

    Take the $80 million white elephant ARIS, the $10-15 millions used for the Acuity/Predictive, the millions used in construction of phased out of schools that created these 6-7 small schools, the millions used to pay those 6-7 principals, the millions wasted on the useless Leadership Academy, and the millions used to pay the extremely bloated Tweed educrats and use the money to hire the ATR guidance counselors and social workers so they can help our students in their time of emotional and academic needs.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100002397245457 Mary Conway-Spiegel

    That would be an incredibly effective way to use money and put Students First…Always.  

  • Mikkemadden

    i noticed that….your comment is right on.  I only hope that our new mayor reads these blogs and puts sense and sensibility back into our schools…..Why, Mr. Bloomdoe, would you have social workers, guidance counselors not working in the schools.  Currently, there are 300 guidance counselors and social workers sitting around in my school (in the auditorium) with nothing to do.  Mr. Bloomdoe, please insert these people (guidance, social workers) back into the schools – the kids need them,,,,- the school staff needs them – counselors and teachers work together in tackling these huge issues our kids have (especially in mott haven south bronx) cmon please put some sense and get these professional in the schools please —i hope our new mayor reads this –  please

  • Mr. Flerporillo

    DOE has to change this system.  Take staff wages out of individual school budgets and put them into the DOE budget.  The current system creates bad incentives and screws principals, students, and teachers, and staff.  I understand that the DOE needs to balance its budget, but it shouldn’t just outsource that job to principals.

  • I noticed that…

    Thank you Mikkemadden.

    As for the new mayor, if it’s Christine Quinn (supported by big $$$$ from Bloomdoe), she’ll use the wrecking ball at every school and at every opportunity.

  • http://twitter.com/leoniehaimson leonie haimson

     Mikkemadden: there are 300 guidance counselors & social workers sitting in yr Auditorium?  If this is true, this is scandalous! Can you contact me offline at leonie@att.net please!

  • Michael M. (parent still)

    I made a very similar point when School Support Networks came out a few years back. 

    I saw it as a rather thin way for the Chancellor to say he was reducing Tweed’s budget and giving principals more CEO-ness.

  • Mikkemadden

    leonie, my comment was that there are 300 guidance counselors and social workers sitting aroung in auditoriums not that they are all in one place… however, does it matter, they are all sittng aournd doing nothing while they could be helping kids

  • Mikkemadden

    Guidance Counselors are the life blood of the school. The average person on the street cannot understand how valuable Guidance Counselors are to the students. Guidance Counselors provide social emotional support for kids in high needs. Guidance Counselors work with staff including Principal, Asst. Principals, teachers in planning out student success paths. Guidance Counselors provide all the programs for students, program changes, transcript reviews with students. college planning with students, family meetings with parents, attendance monitoring…..should I keep going……hire more Guidance Counselors please new Mayor!!Guidance Counselors are the life blood of the school. The average person on the street cannot understand how valuable Guidance Counselors are to the students. Guidance Counselors provide social emotional support for kids in high needs. Guidance Counselors work with staff including Principal, Asst. Principals, teachers in planning out student success paths. Guidance Counselors provide all the programs for students, program changes, transcript reviews with students. college planning with students, family meetings with parents, attendance monitoring…..should I keep going……hire more Guidance Counselors please new Mayor!!MIKKEMADDEN339 minutes ago
    Guidance Counselors are the life blood of the school. The average person on the street cannot understand how valuable Guidance Counselors are to the students. Guidance Counselors provide social emotional support for kids in high needs. Guidance Counselors work with staff including Principal, Asst. Principals, teachers in planning out student success paths. Guidance Counselors provide all the programs for students, program changes, transcript reviews with students. college planning with students, family meetings with parents, attendance monitoring…..should I keep going……hire more Guidance Counselors please new Mayor!!

  • Bryant Felicia

    I graudated last year as a School Counselor and I have yet to find a job…. Why because due to the”budget”.  Therefore, GSC are being overworked with one gsc per school therefore not effectively and affectiionally reaching the students.  Felicia Bryant

  • deuceman99

    Guidance Counselors are a complete waste. They do nothing for the kids. Kids play on the computer when the counselor is supposed to be working with them. Its a joke.

  • Mikkemadden

    Guidance Counselors are the life blood of the school. The average person on the street cannot understand how valuable Guidance Counselors are to the students. Guidance Counselors provide social emotional support for kids in high needs. Guidance Counselors work with staff including Principal, Asst. Principals, teachers in planning out student success paths. Guidance Counselors provide all the programs for students, program changes, transcript reviews with students. college planning with students, family meetings with parents, attendance monitoring…..should I keep going……hire more Guidance Counselors please new Mayor!!Guidance Counselors are the life blood of the school. The average person on the street cannot understand how valuable Guidance Counselors are to the students. Guidance Counselors provide social emotional support for kids in high needs. Guidance Counselors work with staff including Principal, Asst. Principals, teachers in planning out student success paths. Guidance Counselors provide all the programs for students, program changes, transcript reviews with students. college planning with students, family meetings with parents, attendance monitoring…..should I keep going……hire more Guidance Counselors please new Mayor!!MIKKEMADDEN339 minutes ago
    Guidance Counselors are the life blood of the school. The average person on the street cannot understand how valuable Guidance Counselors are to the students. Guidance Counselors provide social emotional support for kids in high needs. Guidance Counselors work with staff including Principal, Asst. Principals, teachers in planning out student success paths. Guidance Counselors provide all the programs for students, program changes, transcript reviews with students. college planning with students, family meetings with parents, attendance monitoring…..should I keep going……hire more Guidance Counselors please new Mayor!!

  • deuceman99

    by the way stop posting the same post., loser – Mikkemadden

  • Tim

    “Guidance Counselors are the life blood of the school.”
    “Guidance Counselors are a complete waste. They do nothing for the kids.”

    I love it when stuff like this happens. 

  • Mikkemadden

    hey tim, are you  a garbage man as well?? lol lol lol  rolling over

  • old teach

    The DOE is once again mismanaging personnel as a key component of the Guidance Counselors work load should be intervention with safety concerns. In Fact, the State at one time required any member serving as a dean of students have credits in counseling. If the school safety committee’s are still utilized, guidance counselors should be a factor in student discipline at least on the secondary level. The malfeasance on the part of the Bloomberg administration continues in the NYC public schools.

  • Mikkemadden

    Thanks old teach, its nice to know we have sane individuals reading these blogs.   

  • Mr. Flerporillo

    I also love that this point-counterpoint has been enshrined in “Comments of the Week.”

  • Philandeb

    There are many new counselors who were hired under the title of community coordinator to get around the hiring freeze. This has helped push more expensive counselors into the ATR pool.

  • Danaohl

    It appears more than apparent that the present mayoral aim is to force out older workers–see the statement made by the 65-year-old plus Mayof, that older Dept. of Education workers should be dismissed–harassment is key to this aim. He and the lackeys and privateers he pays have one aim–and it should, and will be fought by unionized workers, be fought–to let older workers go.
    By the way, his statements last week of so ago, were illegal, as is his aim.
    This is 19th century favoritism writ large–and a Boss Tweed who will live in infamy, not honor.

  • guidancehelpus

    How could they be hired at all if there’s a hiring freeze? Community coordinator isn’t a shortage area.

  • Yolie

    I am a General Education Social Work ATR Can you imagine I developing a relationship with a child with abandonment issues and leaving his school after a week. Is that ethical? Maybe the National Association of Social Workers should look into this

  • Nyr683

    This is so true, counselors in the school are so important so why would bloomdoe have them just sit around?? can someone explain who ever reads this.  I would really like to know how anyone can justify having teaches, counselors sit around, get paid and read the paper every day…Its just that Bloomberg will not admit that it was a mistake to give budget control to each principal.  This has caused people to be displaced, sit around, get paid and do nothing.  Best part is that these professionals are just dying to get back into the classroom.

  • Jouit

    The fact is all these changes are very well thought out and engineered quite intentionally -  either for monetary profit and/or social engineering . . instead of just complaining about it I challenge all you educators to actually do something about it. How about quitting your jobs and venturing out to seek/research methodologies to give humanity a real education that will enables us as a society to free ourselves . . .

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