GothamSchools — daily independent reporting on NYC public schools

wish list

City comptroller proposes hiring 1,600 new guidance counselors

Comptroller John Liu proposed hiring more guidance counselors today at a press conference where he was flanked by union officials and education advocates.

The education policy proposal that Comptroller John Liu put forth today sounded strange coming from the man charged with ensuring the city’s financial health: Add $176 million a year to the Department of Education’s payroll.

But Liu said city students so badly need more help applying to college that it would be worth spending the money to bring on more than 1,500 new guidance counselors, even if he didn’t think the funds could be freed up elsewhere within the department’s $23 billion budget.

“Investment in education today is the best economic development policy for tomorrow,” said Liu, a likely mayoral candidate, at a press conference that also featured union officials and education advocates.

“The economic challenges facing our city can best be addressed by educating many more New Yorkers beyond high school,” he added.

The proposal is the first in the comptroller’s “Beyond High School NYC” initiative, which Liu said today would use research to propose “strategic investments in public education” to raise the college-graduation rate for New York City public school students. Liu’s office calculated that just 21 percent of students who enter city high schools later graduate from college, echoing the city’s own determination that just 21 percent of students are college-ready.

In today’s proposal, Liu calls for the city to hire 1,600 new counselors to join the 1,300 that are already working in city high schools, allowing each counselor to shoulder a caseload of just 100 students. Currently, the student-to-counselor ration is 259:1, his office found, with some counselors supporting many fewer or many more students.

With a smaller caseload, traditional guidance counselors could continue to work with needy students while dedicated college counselors could do more to coach students through the application and financial aid processes, Liu said.

“This is the biggest gap between students and the colleges that they should be going to,” he said.

Liu said the Department of Education could pay for the new counselors, whose salaries would amount to about 1 percent of the department’s annual budget, by reducing its spending on contracts with private vendors. But he also said focusing on the short-term cost would be short-sighted.

“Stepping back away from the idea that this is just about $176 million — no it’s not,” he said. “It’s about what the city needs to be economically competitive and even viable going into the future.”

Responding to Liu’s proposal, Mayor Bloomberg said today that adding more personnel is an attractive but impractical strategy.

“You can never have enough guidance counselors, school crossing guards, physics teachers — in every part of the city we’d like to have more, but you have to have some kind of balance,” he said. ”But I think in this case the DOE is what we’ll rely on to decide what we need.”

The department has concluded that the cost of installing more full-time counselors in each school is too high, Chief Academic Officer Shael Polakow-Suransky said in June.

But the department is taking other approaches to tackle the problem of low college completion. Starting this year, high schools’ annual letter grades will be dependent in part on whether graduates enter and stay in college. The department is also pushing schools to raise academic expectations by giving extra credit to schools that prove that their courses are challenging.

The department is also in the process of sending teachers and staff at each high school to Goddard Riverside Options Center, a nonprofit with experience in guiding students through the college process. The training program, which is privately funded, aims to train one staff member for every 35 seniors at high schools that participate, officials said.

Polakow-Suransky suggested that schools take advantage of the training and also motivate students by making the college application process, for example by turning the actual submission of applications into a celebration.

”Those kinds of culture rituals and making it at the heart of the school’s community don’t actually cost money,” he said.

Liu’s report does include some lower-cost recommendations. He is also calling on the city to create systems to identify when students are falling behind, which some schools already have in place, to connect city schools with area colleges, and to develop programs that bridge the time gap between high school graduation and college matriculation.

Among the options, Liu said, would be to expand the student-run Student Success Centers that currently operate on four high school campuses. Another would be to recruit more of the city’s 400,000 college students to tutor and mentor high schoolers.

But Liu and union officials said those supports should be come in addition to new personnel, not instead of them.

“We should not be farming this out,” said Ernest Logan, head of the Council of School Supervisors and Administrators. “It’s a nice idea for everyone to help … but primarily, it’s our role to do this.”

Guidance counselors are members of the United Federation of Teachers. Currently, 300 of them are without jobs after their positions were eliminated because of budget cuts or school closures. They are being sent to different schools each week, with helping students complete college applications part of their charge.

UFT President Michael Mulgrew said the department could deploy the counselors more effectively. ”While will they not just dispatch them to the schools where the needs are?” he asked.

At least one city educator is not holding his breath for Liu’s proposal to become policy.

“I would love to hire 14 more guidance counselors,” John Galvin, a vice principal of I.S. 318, which has 1,600 students and two counselors, wrote on Twitter.  ”Not happening.”

Liu’s report about the need for more guidance counselors is below.

  • michael

    Bloombucks spends 10 times that amount on consultants, multiple administrators at these smaller schools, and tech. contracts from his friends. So why not use it to help the kids.  10 years, and he still does not have a clue as to what these kids need.

  • Mikkemadden

    Bloomdoe compares crossing guards with guidance counselors!!!!!lol lol lol how much more clueless can you be!! omg…how can you say in the same sentence comparing crossing guards with guidance counselors…..crossing guards are mommies who kill a few hours in the morning….guidance counselors are highly trained, masters graduate level educators….a football coach has to consider adding more quarterbacks or waterboys…..hmmmnn

  • Mikkemadden

    Thank you Mr. Liu for this incredible, detailed report which CLEARLY demonstrates the effectiveness of guidance counselors and the impact they can make on students in the nyc school system.  of course, under the present mayor doe system. they would rather have guidance counselors sit around “excessed” from their former school (which was closed) because currently there are 300 plus guidance counselors sitting around doing nothing and getting paid while hundreds of schools suffer with no guidance counselors or counselors who have 3-400 kids on their caseload……this is how bloomdoe operates. People on the street…im telling you this is what goes on under this administration….you cant make it up

  • Teacher/Counselor

    As a certified Professional School Counselor and a current teacher, I boil it down to three categories of concern: 

    1) We certainly need more counselors — caseloads that prevent counselors from knowing individual students’ names are absurd.2) Many counselors get little to no college guidance training  - I got all of mine during internships, but it was NEVER mentioned during my classes, which were mostly about clinical-style therapy (don’t ask me why) or other duties that don’t really relate to the job.

    3) The reason why kids aren’t going to college has LESS to do with the number of counselors and MORE to do with a lack of LEARNING.  Obviously these are (somewhat) related, but judging by the horrifically low numbers of students achieving college readiness levels on the Integrated Algebra exam (I’m a math teacher, so that’s where my expertise lies) its clear that a majority of NYC public school students just aren’t ready for the rigor of work that any post-secondary institution requires.  I love the idea of every student heading to college, I really do, but we need to keep them in high school (or middle school) a couple extra years, or dramatically improve the effectiveness of what happens in our classrooms, if we really want to make that happen!

    Now, why our students are so far behind? The answer is complicated.  But it’s NOT just about more counselors, and that’s spoken by someone directly impacted by the freeze.

  • Yolie

    Please do not hire new staff take the Guidance Counselor’s, or a General Education Social Worker. I was excessed, because the Principle did not have any money in his budget to keep the only Social Worker for General Education student. I sit all day and read all of the articles in the newspaper including the editorial’s. I wonder what the Union thinks about this? 

  • Mikkemadden

    why are school counselors sent to schools and the principal says can you work in the lunch room….lol hysterical……mop whatever……

Tips, questions, feedback?

Contact us at .

Word from Our Sponsor

Follow GothamSchools

RSS
Subscribe to the daily email digest:

Chalk It Up

Recent Comments

4 comments so far today

Archives

May 2013
M T W T F S S
« Apr  
 12345
6789101112
13141516171819
20212223242526
2728293031