Five percent of D.C. teachers were fired today because of low student test scores. (D.C. Schools Insider)
Details about what’s being discussed in top-secret negotiations on NCLB flexibility. (Politics K-12)
A gadfly gives Rahm Emanuel a T after 6 weeks as Chicago’s mayor, for “tormenting teachers.” (Reader)
A city teacher lists four things she wishes she had done differently last year. (Miss Brave)
A suburban principal got a call from Arne Duncan to talk about the dangers of testing. (Answer Sheet)
A California law requires charter schools to reflect their communities demographically. (BET)
Economist Eric Hanushek: California’s budget strategy, to cut school time, is the worst. (Education Next)
A “wince-worthy” look at a new version of “The Great Gatsby” for today’s students. (Core Knowledge)
A Philadelphia teacher who didn’t witness cheating reflects on his city’s growing scandal. (Notebook)
Ralph
Hmm… the same day we reach a new evaluation agreement, hundreds of teachers are fired in D.C. for poor evaluations… the attacks continue.
Vote NO!
In 2 to 4 years under this new evaluation system thousands of NYC teachers will be fired each year.
Vote NO!
In 2 to 4 years under this new evaluation system thousands of NYC teachers will be fired each year.
Anonymous
This country is really showing its stupid side. Don’t attack the problem, attack the symptoms and exacerbate the problem.
Online Degrees
Thank you for such a nice post. I really enjoyed reading this. The content quality and conclusion is good. Thank you for the post. It’s inspiring stuff
Thank you for such a nice post. I really enjoyed reading this. The content quality and conclusion is good. Thank you for the post. It’s inspiring stuff
wheny ou have 78,000 employees…to keep basic qualiy high you should be eliminating about 5% a year… that would be about 4000 people. So its not really that big a deal. its called quality control… and if you seriously think you cant elimnate 5% of teachers a year to clear way for better you have your head in the sand…or are not involved in real schools in NYC
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=711858292 Paul Rubin
5% a year means that in 5 years, 25% of the teachers in NYC will be fired and another 15% will retire. It wouldn’t take much longer than that to essentially end teaching as a career option in NYC forcing teachers to look at other careers or other cities and states leaving it impossible for NYC to recruit anyone interested in the job as a career. By ten years, you’d have all inexperienced people in the system and NYC would have the least qualified teaching staff in the U.S., possibly the world.
Anonymous
Really in reply to ‘really not that big a deal’
Also, so many teachers have leaving due to the demands, toxicity or realizing it’s just not a good fit for them. You can’t compare this to the typical corporate job. A precious few really need to be fired at this point, and what would likely happen here is the WRONG 5% would be fired, and much of the rest put under totally inappropriate pressures to do silly things. What does that do for the schools? for the students? for the country?
Vote NO!
“to keep basic qualiy high you should be eliminating about 5% a year…
that would be about 4000 people. So its not really that big a deal. its
called quality control…”
“Oh really?” “5% That’s the “magic number?” Are you the “quality control expert?” If we just fire 5% of the teachers every year that will “solve” NYC’s education problems?…The “magic bullet.” I guess? I read the law and I didn’t see any reference to a “5% quota.” Are you sure it’s not “6.3%?” Maybe “8.6%” should be rated “ineffective?”
It’s a VERY big deal! This evaluation system has NOTHING to do with teacher quality. It is about cost control, (removing veteran teachers who are paid more) union busting, and privatization. The teachers in these 33 schools work with some of the highest needs kids in the city. They are not going to score well with these evaluations. Many of them will be fired for circumstances beyond their control. This will make it easier for the city to close the schools and turn them over to charter operators. The student population will be sent to other public schools so the process can be repeated over, and over again until the public school system and UFT are abolished. This has been the observable pattern over the past 8 years. The schools haven’t been turned over to charter operators, but now that is much easier to fire the veteran teachers, it will be easier to bring the charter operators in.
Remember 80% of charter schools perform no better or worse than the public schools.
This is a very expensive process to have an alternative with such a poor result…80% of charters no better, or worse!
Philip Nobile
Teachers will be evaluated on test scores that they mark themselves in unsupervised grading rooms??? The recent Regents scoring reforms are easily evaded. NYSED and the DOE have covered up scrubbing for years and yet there is no investigation of these corrupt state and city officials who abetted this crime spree through inaction. N.B. Klein took the Fifth when the Wall Street Journal (Feb 2) asked for a comment on the paper’s incriminating story re the orgy of 65s in Regents scores. BTW, Randi and Mulgrew covered up, too. They knew and did zero.
Ken Hirsh
“Vote NO!” is probably referring to the national charter study when he/she writes “80% of charters no better, or worse”. The same research organization found that NYC charter schools performed significantly better than traditional public schools. See http://credo.stanford.edu/reports/NYC%202009%20_CREDO.pdf.
It’s annoying how often the misleading national numbers are used in comments on this website without mention of the NYC numbers. I suppose I shouldn’t be surprised since Diane Ravitch does the same thing over and over again when discussing charter school performance.
Take a deep breath
Darling Philip, get a grip.
I sat in a room with 17 other teachers and my AP. I followed the rules like all the other teachers did. There were a few kids who got a 64 and 63 that in years past would pass because of the rules the STATE told us to follow. What about the years when there were no 64’s on the scaled score. The grades went from 63 to 65. That causes a spike in 65’s.I would never cheat for my students because it is wrong and I don’t cheat because I have morals. Also, I think the Regents are pathetic and if they can’t pass them on their own, then they should fail. Most, if not all, the teachers in my department agree with me about the low level of the regents. My problem is that I have students who can pass the regent and not my class.
Do you want outside companies to grade the tests? Yes, lets spend billions on testing companies to grade tests. I’m sure that will work out well. Can’t wait to see how they cheat because they want to keep their contracts.
How about not judging teachers on stupid tests. How about that?
Pogue
Dear Ken,
I too get annoyed and frustrated by all the data, real and fraudulent, that gets bandied about by both sides in the public school debate. If only the charter school “reformers” hadn’t made education a union-busting/profit-making entity instead of helping ALL children throughout the public education system.
Surely, there were more intelligent and creative ways to help kids other than to fire their teachers, close their schools, fool with the their standardized tests, create a competition for kids to get help, and treat those families not in charters as second class citizens.
Maybe there will come a day when the philanthropists and politicians will simply want to help all children without “money-making” and “budget-cutting” strings attached.
Vote NO!
Ken,
“Matthew’s story raises perhaps the most critical question in the debate about
charter schools: do they cherry-pick students, if not by gaming the admissions
process, then by counseling out children who might be more expensive or
difficult to educate — and who could bring down their test scores, graduation
rates and safety records?
Kim Sweet, director of Advocates for Children of New
York, said she had heard many such stories. “When we look at our cases where
children are sent away from schools because of disabilities,” she said, “there
are a disproportionate number of calls about charter schools.” (NY Times 7/10/11)
Regarding the Ross Global Academy…
“Mariama Sanoh, a vice president at the New York Charter Parents Association
who has three kids at the school, said administrators often try to “counsel out”
kids who require special-education services — including her youngest son.
“They’re saying they don’t have the resources to deal with kids with [a]
disability,” said Sanoh. “Instead of helping me, they’re trying to push him out
to a real public school that will give him what he needs.”(NY Post 2/22/10)These are just a couple of examples, but there are many more. It is increasingly clear that many NYC charter schools do NOT take high needs students, who historically don’t do well on standardized exams. The NYC public schools counsel out NOBODY!I’m sorry if the truth is “annoying,” but it is still the truth.
Roma Giudetti
Ken, Let’s see, according tot he CREDO study, in NYC 51% of Charters were better on math scores and 49% were no different or worse, and, in reading 29% were better better, while 71% were no better or worse. Do we really want to throw the word “outperform” around so easily? I get annoyed when people try to act so reasonable and above-the-fray when really they’re still just pushing their own privatizing agenda.
Guest
I dont know why charters have to come into this. actually i do. talk to any administrator who is 60+
they will tell you straight up how the union over time.. lost its mission… and over time went for something that was good for education/kids and teachers… to something that was unreasonable and totally destructive …. for everyone over time… and now teachers are being ATTACKED… wonder why… .
They remember when it suddenly it became impossible to remove people who obviously didnt belong in a classroom… (it hadnt been before)
and as opportunities for women opened up and the quality of people that went into education declined … it became even more important to be able to remove people who didnt have what it takes… and remember its a friggin HARD job.. and it takes alot.. so many many people dont actually cut it. yet they get a job for life… its disgusting and its a crime against our kids.
Any good organization has a bell curve of performers ..and there are high performers and middle and low.. its human nature..
The best teachers are continually amazed by two things.. how stupid their administrators are.. and how have to work along side so many mediocre people… who get away with being so mediocre…
And after your in the system for ten years… you are still the same if you choose to stay in the classroom…. unrecognized..and equal to every inexperienced teacher that walks in off the street… (thanks to the union)
you cant recognize them financially.. . oh you can..reward them.. THROUGH LESS WORK… you give them the honors class.. that is the reward.. or the library… or some position that is easier to teach.. rather than leveraging their skills to really make a difference in the most challenging classrooms..
Giving them.. status.. more money and recognition… cant do that…. thank the union…
I am so happy that the teachers union is going DOWN hard in America… and I hope in its place good teachers.. start demanding new ways to work… more money for more performance… time for collaboration … and professionalize what has turned into a pathetic, loud mouthed, blue collar trade union..
And yes, in education we have as much a challenge in that the administrators seem to be even worse on average than the teachers…. which is why there are a serious attempt now to weed out the worst performers there… (and here is the rub.. the weeders.. have seen a recent brain drain… which really makes me feel hopeless..but fortunately the smart ones or going to other smaller systems.. and making it happen there)
When you have a system.. that values and rewards performance it is a better place to work…
There are radically different abilities among teachers. We are not all auto workers who can screw a car part on the same way…. more or less…
To save the profession…. which is something teachers could really rally around… …. the union must focus on improving teacher effectiveness… we have to wake up…organize for something more important. a real profession…demand things that matters… and get exclusive about who gets membership in the first place.. like every other union out there…
being a union member should indicate that we are a cut above. . more likely to deliver results….and worth the demands that we make… And we need someone with a touch of class… representing us… that might have the qualities of smart educator…
look at that guy representing teachers in New York today. ugh every teachers should be humiliated. That is the intellect that represents us??
Ken Hirsh
Roma, the NYC CREDO study clearly concluded that NYC charter schools have outperformed. I’m not vouching for either CREDO study, but if one is going to use the national study to attack charter schools on a NYC-focused website, one should probably note that the same organization concluded that NYC charter schools have outperformed.
Ken Hirsh
Pogue, I agree with you about the use of data. It can be frequently frustrating. When so many people have an axe to grind, it is difficult to know what to believe.
Ralph
Sorry, I’m replying to “Guest”‘s comment below…
The administration is responsible for getting rid of the teachers who don’t belong in the classroom. The principal and assistant principal have to complete the required paperwork and if tenure is denied, it is actually easy to dismiss a bad teacher. Three years is more than enough time to know whether a teacher is worth keeping.
I hate to say it, but no one wants to listen to good teachers. In this age of education reform, teachers are never given the voice they need. We are told what to do by politicians and millionaires who have never taught a class in their life. Without a union, even good teachers would be out the door. Why do you think Bloomberg was trying to end seniority for teachers, but not for firemen and cops? If you look at the salary scale, cops and firemen are at maximum salary in five years. Teachers take 22 years to reach maximum salary. In year 20, there’s a step worth about 5 thousand dollars and then at 22 a step worth about 10 thousand dollars. That’s after about 12 years of minimal salary increases. If we had no union, we would lose seniority, and then you would watch them find ways to get rid of teachers before they reach their 20th year.
I agree with several things you have said here, but some I strongly disagree. We can rally and make as many demands as possible, all in the name of quality teaching, but no one cares and no one listens to what teachers (or even administrators) have to say… which is exactly why we get Bloomberg, Duncan, Gates, Obama, Cuomo, Klein, etc. and their “education reform” shoved down our throat.
Roma Giudetti
Again, I wouldn’t say based on these results that they clearly or significantly showed that charter schools outperformed NYC schools. Certainly these results don’t justify opening charter schools in place of public schools. It seems like they do as well or very slightly better. Why not improve public schools so that every single child has access to quality education?
Ken Hirsh
Roma, we share the goal that every child should have access to a quality education. I don’t require that education to be provided by a government-run monopoly subject to the UFT contract. Your question would be more meaningful to me if it read “Why not improve public schools while maintaining a government-run monopoly subject to the UFT contract?”. Without the qualification, it is a loaded question. (Wikipedia’s post on loaded questions has the famous example “Have you stopped beating your wife?”.) Similar to my CREDO complaint, I find this repeated rhetorical technique to be frustrating and counterproductive.
Vote NO!
Roma,
The NYC charter schools do NOT perform any better than the public schools. First, charter schools have students whose parents are motivated enough to enter them into the charter school lotteries. Second as I posted earlier this morning, it is increasingly clear that many charters are “counseling out” the high needs students who would bring down their statistics.
This morning’s NY Times article blew any argument justifying charters to help “poor inner city kids get an education equivalent to the wealthy suburban children out of the water.” Charters are trying to move into the suburbs..Why? because those children are being “poorly served” by their highly rated community school districts.? .No! It is because those districts have unionized teachers with health care plans, and pensions.
The only purpose of charters is to break the teachers unions, and destroy the teaching profession in this country. Twenty years ago people would laugh at you for becoming a NYC school teacher. I used to get comments. like “you couldn’t do anything better” or “Why did you do that for?” The city was begging for teachers. That is how all these alternative certification programs, and the Teaching Fellows were started. Today we have “Cadilllac health plans,” and “Golden pensions.” It is really sad, what is happening to workers in this country if our “wages, and benefits” are envied.
The corporate oligarchs will NOT be happy until every worker in this country is making minimum wage, with no health care plan, a crappy 401k plan, and no Social Security or Medicare. This way people can work until the day they die.
Sparklemotion
You are absolutely correct. Corporations are Orwell’s Inner Party. The disappearing middle-class is on track to become the Outer Party, and the urban poor (the kids I teach) are the pleebs. This is all very sad and very scary. Michelle Rhee must head up the Ministry of Truth.
Vote NO!
Regarding Washington DC firing 413 teachers this year 10% of its workforce, and rating nearly another 700 “minimally effective,” which means they will likely be fired next year. Where is the Washington teachers union or the AFT? I haven’t heard anything from any of the union leaders about the ” wholesale firings:” in Washington DC?..I spoke to 6 friends and relatives in private industry, who said it is unheard of to fire nearly 20% of a workforce in a 2 year period for “poor performance.”
Just in case someone wants to reply “this is done in the private sector all the time.” I spoke to 6 different people, working in six different industries who said “NO IT’S NOT!”
Mr. Potter
Hopefully Rhee will end up in Azkaban.
John G
I agree with Mr. Potter. Phillip’s concern is based on an assumption that teachers are corrupt individuals. We are not. We work hard to do our jobs and follow the rules given to us -even when those rules are confusing, are changed frequently or are deliberately manipulated in such a way that the general public would believe that teachers are corrupt.
We are not corrupt. We’re teachers. #duh
prince warren
Wow, your post is dead on. This made me actually feel like someone knows what they’re talking about. I agree 100%. Bust unions with charters is the plan. I’m wondering if they will have “charter fire houses” or “charter police precincts”?? My neighbor is a “financial district” guy, whatever that means but that’s what he always told me. He leaves his house at 7:30 a.m. and gets home about 7:30 p.m. The other day he was so pissed because I guess he saw me coming home from the beach around when he got in, after 7p.m. The next day he said “I should have been a teacher.” Everyone wants to be a teacher all of a sudden. You’re right! When it was looked down upon no one was saying anything positive BUT now, it’s the dream job. There’s only one job that’s better and that’s at the fire house. Cooking, playing basketball, shooting pool, and working 2x per week has got us beat by a mile.In my next life I will absolutely be a firefighter.
Sparkelmotion
Holy crap, you’re so incredibly wrong about firefighters. They have to deal with data, just like we do, and their lives are on the line. I’ve been happily married to a firefighter for many years. We’ve grown accustomed to the fact that while at work, he never sleeps for more than 15 minutes at a time so he has bizarre sleeping patterns and tends to fall asleep while sitting up at the dinner table. Those cooked meals? They get eaten cold after being interrupted by fires, gas leaks, accidents, and false alarms. His work hours are insane, and he’s had his fair share of 2nd & 3rd degree burns. Let’s not forget to mention broken bones, torn muscles, fractures, and all the crap that got inhaled during 9/11 – we have friends with lymphoma and severe asthma. Teaching has it’s perks, but firefighting should NEVER been seen as cushy. They earn every minute of down time, probably more so than we do.
John G
Ken, not only is it a loaded question when re- framed to your liking, your tone came away as pompous and arrogant. Specifically, it ignored Roma’s terrific question (why don’t we as a society focus our efforts on improving school through the public school model of education?) and replaced it something that indicted my union AND the NYCDOE at the same time (heretofore, I didn’t think a broad enough brush existed to achieve that feat). You’re obviously a smart guy, willing to have the tough conversations about the topic, and yet you ignored that question that you were asked. It’s an important one. Please believe me.
Moreover, it seemed to me that you glossed over your sidestep with a smoke screen of petulance. Yuk! Look, if you’re helping to focus a conversation on charter schools vs. public, it is not reasonable to ignore a question like Roma’s, as it is both valid and important to the discussion that you (as I have gathered from your very articulate posts here over the past several weeks) seem to want very much to have.
So whether or or not your convenience is served by her questions, I’d like to remind you that this topic is more important than any one person, redirect your your attention to it and ask you clearly and directly in a language that can be easily understood: will you please answer her question?
And just to remind you, her question was “Why not improve public schools so that every child has access to a quality education?” I assure you, it’s not rhetorical. I promise you it needs to answered (using facts as the basis for the answer and whether it frustrates you or not) and I submit to you that it has to once been answered with facts by any advocate or fan of the charter school movement.
Thanks
Roma Giudetti
Ken, as I said from the very beginning, you have an agenda. Your agenda is to privatize public education – to bust the “government-run monopoly” as you say as well as the teachers union. I’m not asking a rhetorical question. It seems to me that as hard as the CREDO study tried, it didn’t find that charter schools “significantly outperformed” public schools in New York City. So again, why are we not trying to improve public education so that all kids, not just a few lottery winners, can have access to quality instruction? Again, you try to put on that oh-so-reasonable, above-the-fray act, but you get annoyed when someone doesn’t agree with you. Thank you John G. for calling Ken on his childish and churlish response.
Roma Giudetti
Vote No! You’re preaching to the choir here. In fact, my whole argument is that charter schools seem not to do any better than public schools so instead of investing in them why are we not working to improve public schools.
Ken Hirsh
John G, the basic answer is that the traditional public school model of education in NYC (as I understand it) suggests a government-run monopoly and excessively restrictive union contracts. These characteristics are a big part of the problem and, therefore, must be challenged to reach an optimal solution. Charter schools challenge both the government-run monopoly and excessive union contracts. Meanwhile, when reformers challenge things like LIFO, lockstep pay, excessive termination procedures, etc., they ARE attempting to improve traditional public schools. These are not, of course, efforts in which everyone agrees.
That basic viewpoint, right or wrong, has been stated so many times by so many people that it is surprising that people still ask reformers “Why not improve (traditional) public schools?” as if the basic answer (again, right or wrong) hasn’t been given repeatedly. Perhaps we are talking past each other. I think it is more productive to drill down to more specific questions or challenges (which many commenters, of course, have done).
Finally, I think the question “Why not improve public schools so that every single child has access to quality education?” suggests something more sinister than your question (“Why don’t we… focus our efforts on improving school through the public school model of education?”). That could just be my petulance!
Old Dude
100% true for sure! I could not agree more with the above posting as I was hired by the city 16 years ago when they were begging for teachers. Now we are treated like garbage!
Ken Hirsh
Roma, from the NYC CREDO study:
“The results also show that in New York City Black and Hispanic students enrolled in charter schools do significantly better in reading and math compared to their counterparts in traditional public schools. Charter students from most starting points also tend to do better than their peers in traditional public schools. The results for students in poverty however, only show a statistical positive impact in reading and no significant difference in math as compared to their counterparts in traditional public schools. Special Education students and English Language Learner students in charter schools in New York City receive no significant benefit or loss from charter school attendance compared to their counterparts in traditional public schools in reading and math. In summary, the charter school performance is generally positive in New York City compared to that of traditional public schools. These results also compare positively to our national pooled results.”
If you don’t like “significantly outperform”, maybe “generally positive compared to that of traditional public schools”? Again, my major point is that people shouldn’t use the 80% number from the national study and ignore the NYC study. Again, I don’t vouch for either study.
I still don’t understand your question “Why are we not trying to improve public education…”. How can you say that Bloomberg and other reformers haven’t tried (and aren’t trying) to improve public education? Maybe you think they have terrible ideas, but you don’t think they have tried?
Guest
In companies that are complete turnarounds like the dc system. Not normal companies but wastelands of neglect. Yes it certainly is done
John G
Ken,
Since your
concern about sinister things didn’t sound irritable, it wouldn’t appear to me
be petulant. Whether it’s reasonable or not is another question. What is
sinisterly suggested by that question? I’m honestly missing it. Having said
that, your answer was straightforward and plain. Thanks for it.
Reformer is an
interesting label, can we start there? It’sone worth MUCH debate (although not
here). Historically, the word reformer has been associated with people who
changed the method of education for students. How interesting that the label
associated with that torch has been passed from Elizabeth Montessori to Michelle
Rhee; from John Dewey to Joel Klein; from Paolo Frierre (who’s change was
rooted in the classroom) to Bill Gates (who has spent no time there). Whereas the
historic reformers attempted to improve through expert pedagogy, this new crop
of reformers believe that education will get better if only we get rid of a pay
scale that codifies teaching as a lifelong profession (what you call lockstep
pay), a layoff process intended to get rid of unfair firings (what you ID as
LIFO) and other protections that you correctly identified.
They try to improve
reform by holding teachers accountable. Sure, I am aware of this argument (and I think it’s aterrible idea, AND I’ll say they’re not trying to help, because that’s just how folks get now and then). We
all are. But what do they offer as proof that if teachers were accountable,
education in America would be so much better??? As evidence that if only the
agenda were fulfilled, that achievement results would drastically change? The
answer seems to me that their evidence comes from their successes from the
charter school movement. That evidence is based on no lockstep pay and no seniority
protections (or at least includes these components). But the results haven’t
blown anyone away, now have they? Instead of being able to say “See? Look what
happens when we get rid of teachers’ unions!”, there is more debate –among genuine
pundits!- about whether or not the
corporate reformers and charter schools are actually the agents of change that ‘Superman’
made them out to be. When charter students in poverty show no measured growth in math we have to ask ourselves, do we really need to burn down the house?? And however THAT debate pans out, the simple truth is that
there IS a general consensus; even if charters are better, they’re really not
that much better as to blow the doors off the system that you (not very
correctly, in my opinion) identify as a government run monopoly with too many
union protections (by the way, I didn’t think there was a broad enough brush in
the world for a person to indict both the DOE and the UFT in the same sentence.
I tip my hat to you).
But I assumed
all this when I asked you to answer Roma’s question. Whatsmore, I assumed that
all of this was an assumption for you as well. That the success of non union
teaching with our population of students is not clear, but well within
reasonable debate. That’s why I thought it was a fair question. Can ask it
again? Assuming all that we know about how charters aren’t really amazingly,
amazingly successful, why not focus on the public schools, where most of the
kids are anyway?? I’ll understand if you decide not to address it.
(btw, about that debate
I just mentioned: it won’t be happening anytime soon. Because of this one-trick
pony the corporate reformers have (of ‘blame the union’ and ‘blame the teachers’)
a very polarized atmosphere has evolved. Folks on my side (who understanding there
to be a war on teachers) aren’t much interested in listening to corporate, or
corporate minded reformers, and we’re even less interested in listening to people
who straddle the fence, or aren’t genuine stakeholders in this thing we call
urban education. These days, and for the foreseeable future, it’s going to be
all about the fight. The fight against a defunct argument about charter school
success, about how all of these tests hurt our students, about who deserves to
actually be in our profession (and who does not), or about whether removing
teacher protections not only hurts good dedicated people in the classroom, but reminds
us all of the general war on teachers that’s currently underway. Many of us
will be in DC at the end of this month to express this polarization. You should
go check it out.
See how reasonable teachers are being.)
Ken Hirsh
John G,
Thanks for all of this. A few thoughts:
1. I get your point on the “reformer” label.
2. I think that the Bloomberg administration has made huge efforts to reform traditional public schools. You might not agree with what they have done, but I don’t see how one could suggest they haven’t made an effort.
3. The UFT has successfully blocked or slowed many of the things Bloomberg has wanted to do. After such successful resistance, it seems unfair for those same people to ask “Why are the schools not better?” without any reference to their own role in sabotaging the administration’s strategy. It’s like asking someone why they are running so slowly as you cling to their legs. (Of course, it is entirely fair to criticize the attempted reforms.)
4. I’ve been pleased with the performance and rate of progress of the charter movement in NYC, but I understand that the evidence has not been overwhelming. (I would characterize the evidence as somewhere between “encouraging” and “strong”, although parental demand might be better described as “very strong”.) To be clear, I don’t think there is any one set of results or data that can be used as the acid test for charter schools. One needs to make a judgment.
Ken Hirsh
John G,
Thanks for all of this. A few thoughts:
1. I get your point on the “reformer” label.
2. I think that the Bloomberg administration has made huge efforts to reform traditional public schools. You might not agree with what they have done, but I don’t see how one could suggest they haven’t made an effort.
3. The UFT has successfully blocked or slowed many of the things Bloomberg has wanted to do. After such successful resistance, it seems unfair for those same people to ask “Why are the schools not better?” without any reference to their own role in sabotaging the administration’s strategy. It’s like asking someone why they are running so slowly as you cling to their legs. (Of course, it is entirely fair to criticize the attempted reforms.)
4. I’ve been pleased with the performance and rate of progress of the charter movement in NYC, but I understand that the evidence has not been overwhelming. (I would characterize the evidence as somewhere between “encouraging” and “strong”, although parental demand might be better described as “very strong”.) To be clear, I don’t think there is any one set of results or data that can be used as the acid test for charter schools. One needs to make a judgment.
Anonymous
Ken,
Everyone is looking for silver bullets, or at least traces of silver in methods and educational ideologies. The charters were meant to help trad. public schools, not compete with them, as I’m sure you know. Probably due in part to all of the divisiveness, desperation, test prep mania, infancy of tech applications/online learning and horrendous economy, it doesn’t look like significant silver fragments have been found in any quarter; no breakthrough methods that work consistently across types of schools and varying demographics.
I don’t think that “excessively restrictive union contracts” or being gov’t run are such big parts of the problem. I think the big problem is not having clear answers as to what public ed should and could be in this society, what things can really “fly” consistently, and what things should.
Finally, you must realize that when some people say/write “public education” they are excluding the ‘privatized’ versions, and you’ve never run across people who suspect Bloomberg and monetarily-significant others may in fact wish to essentially “gentrify” NYC and turn all non-specialized schools into McDiploma-in-a-Box’s? And when I see idea after idea of the deformers, I must conclude that, as a whole, they are either, let’s just say, ‘lacking’ when it comes to education, kids, parents, teachers and schools, or they have some serious ulterior motives that do not include the preservation of public ed. as we know it AND are ‘lacking’.
Roma Giudetti
Again, to me the charter school results show a mixed-bag. I don’t see overwhelmingly clear positive results for NYC charters from this study. Most importantly, they don’t do any better with the kids who are the hardest to educate — your SpEd kids and ELLs. Furthermore, I do not think that Bloomberg and other reformers are trying to improve public education. I think they don’t give a hoot about improving public education. I think they care mostly about breaking the teachers union and having a cheap supply of labor that they can fire at will. I don’t think it’s proven that any of these reforms have helped improve education. I also think the over-reliance on testing isn’t to serve the kids but to find a way to fire teachers. In the end, good schools are a collaboration between the adults. It is very hard to figure out where the contribution of one teacher begins and another teacher ends. Teaching is messy. It’s not easily quantifiable. I think the last ten years of the Bloomberg administration has shown how off the mark the reform movement has been. I have children in the public school as well as being a teacher. I can say that once, middle class kids in the system got a good education – after Bloomberg and Klein nothing works and the education of all children has been miserably compromised.
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