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Gifted Gazette

November 2, 2009

Non-DOE Group Holds G&T Info Session for Parents

by Michael McCurdy, at 9:26 am

Last Thursday I participated in the Bright Kids NYC parent information session about OLSAT test prep and general information about the NYC gifted and talented program. Bright Kids NYC is a program that prepares children in pre-K through second grade to take standardized tests.

I sat on the G&T panel and answered questions from prospective G&T parents. Along with three other parents, there were also two teachers on the panel — one who teaches gifted and talented students and another who actually proctored the OLSAT and BRSA tests for several years. Bige Doruk, founder of Bright Kids, gave a presentation beforehand.

About 40 parents attended the session scheduled from 6:30 to 8 p.m. After it was all said and done we didn’t get out of session until after 9 p.m. due to the high interest and interaction amongst audience members! The participation levels were extremely high especially in the area of OLSAT and BRSA test prep. I was bombarded by questions from parents during and after the session due to my personal experience with gifted and talented program at PS 33 Chelsea Prep, which my child attends.

This session provided a true forum for parents to find out the “ins and outs” of the OLSAT and BRSA tests and how to navigate through the NYC gifted and talented program admissions process effectively. Due to the setting and content of the meeting I’d have to say this information session was far better than the DOE NYC gifted and talented information session I attended. I think the more intimate setting of this session provided the atmosphere prospective parents of G&T students needed to get their questions and concerns answered.

In previous postings I wrote about the top 10 things the DOE should do to improve gifted and talented information sessions and also my personal experience while attending the gifted and talented information session in Manhattan a couple of weeks ago.

I’d like to hear from Gothamschools readers about gifted and talented information sessions for parents. Are the sessions necessary or should content on the internet and the DOE web site suffice?

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  • Bonnie

    Okay, this must be spam. We get it. Btw, that guy got one kid into a district G&T and is now on the panel of a test prep company? Can it be any more obvious?

  • Tim

    We’re well beyond the point where someone from Gotham Schools ought to explain what exactly the value of this feature is supposed to be.

    One of these things (community posters) is not like the others . . . and it’s not just the shilling for the test prep, but the caliber of the writing and insight. 

  • Kristin

    Spam. Shill. Please remove this and it’s ilk from an otherwise decent information source for NYC parents.

  • john

    well, then doe should make their sessions more productive – doe’s incompetence is putting $s in other people’s pockets.

    At least it must have been nice to talk to parents and teachers who have kids in programs and answer the questions in a frank way – the one from the DOE was useless… i attended the one in queens and learned nothing i could not get off the website.

  • Bonnie

    John, what else do you need to know beyond what’s on the website and the booklet? It is such a straight forward process.

  • jenny

    I attended the workshop. It was nice to get persepetive from real people. The discussions were very good and the panelists were very open about how they looked at things. Also i did appreciate the teacher’s input on the OLSAT, especially from those who adminsitered it the last 3 years. Actually it is not a straightforward process. Many parents are in good public zones wondering if it was worth it to go to a G&T over a good public. Also, it was nice to get the inside scoop about the different schools, their approach and how people ranked their choices. Frankly it was the best $65 I spent and many attendees walked out feeling the same way. I guess there are other people who feel the same way since the event was overssubscribed and they ran out of seats.

  • Kate

    Ok, Jenny? , tell me how could there have been teachers there that administer the OLSAT when this session was the same night as I was meeting with the teachers at school at NEST? All teachers were required to be at the parent-teacher conferences. All public schools had there conferences on Oct. 29th (until 8 PM)and 30th.

  • jenny

    The teachers were from Anderson and ps 116 G&T and lower lab in additon to a few who had adminsitered the OLSAT from non-G&T schools. There was no teacher from NEST but all the other schools were well represented. Many public schools have parent teacher conferences tomorrow.

  • john

    DOE and straightforward do not belong in the same sentence. I find the process very cumbesome and the “real, honest” information to be very scarce. Have you ever talked to the G&T people on the phone? you can never get a straight answer. i asked them the difference between the G&T schools and all they can tell me is they are all good? what does that mean? i would like to know if this company will have another session so that i can attend. Please keep us informed.

  • Tim

    Wait a minute — Jenny, are you saying that it cost $65 to attend this “parent information session”???

    How in the world can the author then write this . . . 

    “Due to the setting and content of the meeting I’d have to say this information session was far better than the DOE NYC gifted and talented information session I attended. I think the more intimate setting of this session provided the atmosphere prospective parents of G&T students needed to get their questions and concerns answered.”

    with a straight face?

    Gotham Schools, “Wise Up” ain’t just a great Aimee Mann song.

  • anthony

    i am glad that there is someone like michael attending sessions and participating to give us information on what is available out there. hey, he is doing this on his own time so a little respect please…i am a dad just like him so..i get it.

  • Kate

    Come on Anthony, this writer, Michael is clearly on the payroll of this tutoring company. Everything he writes has a strong bias and he and the owner of the company are both from Texas, so I am guessing they have known each other for awhile. I wrote to Michael many months ago to ask him why he was promoting this company and he wrote back to me that no other company contacted him – well that makes perfect sense, right? If you really want to know about G&T programs or tutoring then by all means, do not do ANY research just wait for them to contact you. I mean JEEZE, they have been doing this since this summer so they must be experts, right?

  • http://www.classsizematters.org Leonie Haimson

    Beyond the quite reasonable criticism expressed by many about the possible financial interests of this columnist in promoting this company, I would like to point out that the entire industry and the practice of prepping extremely young chidren for these tests is a horrible idea and should not be encouraged. Shouldn’t there also be some outrage about this?

  • anthony

    i actually emailed him if he was affiliated with any company inlcuding thinktonight that he promotes and bright kids and he is not any payroll. He works for a HR recruiting company and is a regular joe. i think, kate, you need some facts before you start posting on public boards and claiming such relationships. Why do you care? he can promote whoever he wants to promote – no different than a journalist as he is simply a “blogger”.

  • kate

    Well my dear Anthony (if that is who you truly are) you are quite naiive or at least you think we all are,… he is pretending to help parents with his insight and lousy writing. Parents look for information that can help them not disinformation or paid biased information. I have been following him for sometime wondering what his angle was because he mostly had lists on his blog and no real wisdom or “review” of what might work best. That was until he “reviewed” the tutoring company he supports. He suddenly had insight into a program, that according to everything he wrote, he did not use them – though how could he, they have only been in existence since June. I am merely stating that if a “blogger” expects to have credibility then he has to be more than a mouthpiece for people who pay him to promote their company. Also I am positive thinktonight pays to have their ad on his blog , do you really think we are that dumb to think otherwise?

  • Bonnie

    John, yes, I have spoken to the G&T folks over the phone and through letters and e-mails because there were problems with my son’s test and placement. I worked with them and they worked with me and we straightened everything out. I have to say it again, the G&T application and testing was one of the easiest things I had to do in my life. But then, I am not the micro-managerial type of person who goes bezerk at the first signs of complications.

  • kathy bates

    i had a very difficult time with the G&T and getting any concrete information. It is impossible to get real information in schools other than manhattan. I am in disrtict 22 and i was treated like a second class citizen. Having a paid information session is fine, as long as everyone knows that it costs money to attend. i would have gald to talk to teachers and and parents from schools and have more in depth my questions anwered.

    On another note, gothom schools should remove these posts from kate – she is ruining the intergity of the site. She clearly has real personal issues with michael and or a company noone else cares about.

  • kate

    Kathy Bates, … I loved you in that movie “Misery” BTW, but why dont I have the right to speak out against poor writing like the others above like Bonnie, Tim and Kristen (first 3 comments)? I think it adds to the integrity of a websight when all can speak freely. Like I said, I wrote to Michael a few months ago to get some more information and it was obvious then as it is now why he is writing this stuff.

  • http://nycgiftedandtalented.wordpress.com Michael McCurdy

    Hi Everyone – my apologies for not indicating the information session from Bright Kids did charge a fee of $65 to attend. Please keep in mind the information session was held a very high-end facility with food and drinks (including alcohol) for attendees. As mentioned above, some parents found it worth every penny of the $65 to have access to former OLSAT test proctors and parents who have students in the G&T program. Now, to address the comments from Kate that are false and untrue. I am in NO way compensated or paid in any way what so ever by Bright Kids NYC and there’s no “Texas connection” with me and the CEO of Bright Kids. Texas is a BIG state folks – over 24million people! I just met the CEO of Bright Kids a few months so there goes the whole “Texas conspiracy theory”. When it’s all said and done, I’m a parent of a kindergarten student in the G&T program. I started writing on this topic b/c I knew there were other parents out there like me who needed information. I know some parents find the G&T process straight forward but many do not (like me). I write out of passion on this topic, not for monetary gains. Kate – I’d recommend you get your facts straight before writing defamatory statements.

  • kathy bates

    yes, kate, unfortunately that is my real maiden name and it sucks. and kate you have real personal issues you need to take off line. gothom schools asked michael to be on their site as i believe he has provided very valuable information to the rest of us. if you do not like him, then stop reading about him and the company and get off this site so we can have a real discussion. it is ok to disgaree, but personal slander and attacks are too much – this is how i can tell you have REAL personal issues.

    Michael, thanks for the clarification – i appreciate all your help and please keep us posted on all the other infromation sessions (paid or unpaid) people may have by any company.

  • kate

    Michael, I apologize if I called your writing “poor”. But I ask, if you have a “passion” for this topic, why all the disinformation or what others above have called spam? The only point I was trying to make is that you do not appear any more informed on this topic than any other parent with a child in a lower level G&T program.

  • kate

    Kathy, I am offended by your comments. Why are you trying to put me in a category of having personal issues because I think there are too many people without any real knowledge feeding parents disinformation. If Michael had done his homework many moons ago, he might be in a position to truly help parents.

  • Michael M.

    Folks,
    While we’re all trying to play nice in the sandbox, set good examples for our kids, etc., I encourage all on these G&T strings to bear in mind that on a number of charter-related strings on this site, there HAVE been a good number of instances of commenters not being completely forthright about their own horses in the race.

    It’s a matter of full disclosure, so that readers can judge the content in a context, but does not warrant ad hominem attacks.

    Frankly, I would LOVE it if there were similar sets of essays for IEP kids, ELL kids, Middle School admissions, High School Admissions, etc., etc.

  • kathy bates

    kate you are posting “false” comments about people and their relationships to companies. You are making people look bad for no reason or for a personal reason. if you disgaree, disagree without attacks, slander and defomation. You did not simply say i do not write Michael’s writing – you went far beyond that and tried to tie him to company and an owner he is not related to. that is personal. and yes, fyi it is leaglly actionable in the state of NY.

  • kate

    Yes, Michael, this must have been what the early colonial days were like when people published their own little pamphlets and others wrote scathing critisisms in the local papers about them. Thank you for keeping the doors of free speech open. I am sorry if you wrongly state my comments are defamatory or disagree with my opinion. It is what it is.

  • kate

    Kathy, this is the last I will say about this. ..they are both from Texas, he never had an opinion until he met this tutoring company and when asked about why he was promoting them , he said they were the only ones that contacted him. It is not making false statements to say that it all appears convoluted to me, it is my opinion. … and like I said above “If Michael had done his homework many moons ago, he might be in a position to truly help parents.” It is sad but it is my opnion. Why the attacks on me? Others pointed out stronger opinions than mine, i.e. the first 3 comments!

  • kathy bates

    You have the strongest attacks – no doubt. I finally called bright kids and asked about the relationship to michael of which i found out there is none. The owner went to school in texas for 2 years as well as in boston and south carolina and is not from texas – in fact she grew up in a foreign country. She also said that they said you post bad things about them everywhere and you actually represent competetion and your real name is just like mine kathy – it is all over the blogs and on many sites like gocity kids and in your own website(she directed me to all of them sucessfully). I am going to be more professional here than you – and not say anymore. Your incentives to me are now 100% clear and everyone reading this should know that you represent the other tutoring company. Now at least i can rest in peace and understand why you were so upset.

  • Bonnie

    I agree with Kate that the author of this blog does not seem to have the credentials to speak about G&T in NYC authoritatively. Somehow it does make me wonder, though, how he ended up on the discussion panel since all the experience he has with G&T is one school and one child who went through the application process. It just doesn’t vibe.

  • Bonnie

    Leonie: yes, maybe we should steer the discussion toward our excellent point. What do we think about prepping four year old children?

  • kate

    LOL.. Kathy, that is ridiculous and paranoid to say the least! I could care less about this or any other tutoring company, my only agenda is to push people to get more info instead of relying on someone claiming to be an expert , like the writer of this blog. I didn’t even know I had a website, which one do I have?

    signed, KATE (no more no less, not even short for Katherine)

  • Michael M.

    Mr. McCurdy,

    In the spirit of full disclosure, and as you went to some length to frame yourself as having no skin in the game other than as parent-advocate, do you accept ad revenue from any ThinkTonite.com (also in the test prep biz) or any other advertisers on your blogs, and do you accept services from BrightKids at any discount from retail?

    BTW, Texas may be big. But so is New York City. The NYC Public Schools system is roughly 8 times the size of the average school district in Texas.

    As to BrightKidsNYC… per its site, the CEO went to a “high-end” business school, worked for a “high-end” consulting firm, and is now in a for-profit business, no? Plenty of entrepreneurial spirit, but NO educational credentials.

    Further, I find it ironic, if not unethical, that while parents had to sign non-disclosure agreements to see the G&T tests, a for-profit firm is charging parents for the insider-information of former OLSAT proctors. There outta be a law.

    Some say NYC is already a rat race, and some parents with good intentions and some with $65 to spare for “high-end” booze-and-shmooze (and a sales pitch?) may be adding to the stereotype. But I’d just rather the city, and the nation, not turn into a test prep puppy mill. Kids have better things to do with their time.

    There’s more to education and child development, and parent development, than climbing over the other 90% (let alone 97% per the citywide standard). Note that MOST of the parents in Mr. McCurdy’s District 2 chose to keep their kids in their neighborhood schools, and forego the districtwide G&T slots for which they qualified.

  • http://nycgiftedandtalented.wordpress.com Michael McCurdy

    As I stated before, my writings are about my own personal experience with the NYC G&T program. I’ve never claimed to be an expert on the topic – just a father who is concerned with their child’s education who shares his experience, strength and hope for other parents out there in NYC. When our child got accepted to the G&T program there was no information available from a parent’s view point, that’s why I started writing about it. After my first blog posting I found many other parents in NYC had many of the same questions and concerns. I’m glad I was able to help them out in some sort of small way.

    Test prepping a pre-K student is a great topic for discussion and I’d like to hear what people think about that topic – without getting into personal attacks. In the end, we can agree to disagree but let’s the personal attacks out of the conversation. Yes, most of district 2 parents did select to keep their child in the gen ed schools in their neighborhoods. There are plenty of good gen ed schools available and if you’re zoned for a good gen ed school it’s a tough decision to send your child elsewhere (as it was in our case). We are happy with our decision so far. We’ve seen tremendous progress with our child in 2 short months since school has started.

  • Mary

    I am disturbed by the personal attacks against the writer of the blog on g/t. I am against test prep, but not against the g/t programs.

    Regarding test prep, here is my advice and what worked for my daughter.

    1. Go over the test sample in the DOE handbook two to three times to get them used to the questions asked and taking a test in general.

    2. Have them get a good night sleep and eat a good breakfast

    3. Tell them to have fun with the test and not to worry about doing well. It’s no big deal.

    I also didn’t sweat it. The handbooks and tests are free. My daughter’s educational career and success in life is not based on whether she is in the program or not. I thought she was ready for such a test after she took the practice test in the handbook.

    Thanks for writing this blog, Michael. I appreciate GS allowing this forum, and I’m sure will consider the suggestions of the other Michael about having community forums about IEPs, etc.

  • Michael M.

    Just between us Michaels….
    Why didn’t you answer my straight up question?

    For broader context, on GothamSchools, we’ve seen plenty of “astroturfing” from faux grass-rootsiness charter advocates (here comes the hate mail), so pardon my sensitivity, due to that front.

    That being said, I took to heart something VP Biden said during the campaign, “Try not to question someone’s motives, stick to their judgement.” I have no doubt you — and all parents — have their kids’ best interests at heart.

    But I think any official blogger on GothamSchools owes the readership the straight poop on their personal and financial interests as well. “Personal experience with the NYC G&T Program” is fine, but a number of us are questioning, not attacking, if that’s the entire pertinent context. This goes double for official bloggers on a neutral site.

    And again, as I said above, I welcome more such blogs. But all cards should be on the table. Cheers.

  • http://nycgiftedandtalented.wordpress.com Michael McCurdy

    As stated before, I am in NO way compensated or paid in any way what so ever by Bright Kids NYC and there’s no “Texas connection” with me and the CEO of Bright Kids. I don’t receive any services from Bright Kids either at a discount or for free. Our child is already in the G&T program and I have no plans to re-test her. We’re completely satisfied with the district wide program and don’t see the need for her to attend the city-wide program. We didn’t use a tutoring service for our child prior to taking the OLSAT this past Feb. We did some sample questions, etc. but no “formal” tutoring. At the time, we were naive NYC parents who recently relocated from Texas who had absolutely no idea about G&T program until our child came home one day from pre-K with a note in her backpack telling us about the OLSAT test. Honestly, I thought such programs were for grades 6 and up…not for kindergarten. Everything in NYC is quite different than what we were used to in Texas.

    To get back on topic. Mary – I like your 3 points and it sounds like a very practical approach to addressing the testing concept to your child in a non-pressured way.

  • Michael M.

    Thanks much, Michael McC.

    Agreed, Mary. Love the three points.

    Both:
    No intent on my part to “attack” while encouraging such forums.

    ALL:
    Note that the deadline to file a Request for Testing for G&T slots for next fall (entering K thru 3rd) is this Friday, November 6.

    The DOE website has handbooks for children born in each of 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005 (roughly current grades PreK thru 2nd).

    Best wishes to all.

  • frank h.

    i am so glad that michael is providing valuable information and attending workshops and events so we can be better informed.
    Test prepping is hard for young children but i know a lot of asian children who start working at a very young age with tutors. part of this is very cultural. i will prepare my child for the OLSAT since it is a test and that at leaPt then i can sleep better at night knowng that i have done my best. i do not think his pre-school teaches him everything and there are too many kids. my neighbor is a teacher so i have asked her to work with him once a week as i work too many hours. I see no harm in this at all….he is having fun and actually looks forward to his sessions. We also work with him adhoc on weekends and bought some games on line to help with his vocabulary etc.

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