Comments on: Among new small high schools, enrollment patterns vary

By: Smith

Smith — Fri, 25 Sep 2009 23:45:46 +0000

Interesting. I’m also wondering about the comparitive numbers of high-absence students, however that might be defined. Moving from a screening school to a non-screening school I noticed a larger number of such students.

By: Aaron Pallas

Aaron Pallas — Fri, 25 Sep 2009 01:51:34 +0000

Smith, yes, we did look at eighth-grade attendance rates as one of the features of incoming 9th-grade students. Overall, for 2002 to 2008, the eighth-grade attendance of incoming ninth-graders in new small schools is very similar to the eighth-grade attendance of 9th-graders entering existing schools. But over this same period, the eighth-grade attendance of 9th-graders enrolling in the new small schools which replaced the large comprehensive high schools which closed or downsized was about 5 percentage points higher than the eighth-grade attendance of students entering those closing large high schools.

By: Smith

Smith — Fri, 25 Sep 2009 00:17:10 +0000

Did the study look at 8th grade attendance rates? Two kids can look the same on paper if you’re just using reading scores and income. But anyone who teaches a first or last period high school class can tell you how important attendance is in predicting student success.

By: Ellen

Ellen — Wed, 23 Sep 2009 23:10:42 +0000

“Meyer’s statement said Pallas and Jennings, “completely misunderstand the small schools initiative, which has been heralded as a success by President Obama, Education Secretary Duncan, and Bill Gates.”

Then why did Bill Gates pull out of the small schools movement…he said there was no reliable research that pointed to significant academic improvement. Maybe the education world has lost its focus? Are we at the Mad Hatter’s Tea Party? It’s been a very merry un-birthday……

By: peter

peter — Wed, 23 Sep 2009 21:14:32 +0000

The DOE response: an attack on the authors, and ignorant comments show they failed to read the report or attend the session.

The data speaks for itself.

Both large and small hs principals attended and commented, as well as other researchers and parents.

The DOE Communication Office has only succeeded in rallying those who increasingly see Children First as a house of cards.

By: Aaron Pallas

Aaron Pallas — Wed, 23 Sep 2009 17:09:04 +0000

Michael M.,
that’s an important question, and we don’t have the data in hand to address it in a persuasive way.

By: Michael M.

Michael M. — Wed, 23 Sep 2009 15:43:28 +0000

I appreciate any work by Aaron and Jennifer.

But I’d be much more interested in the performance of students AFTER they got to high schools of one size or another (after calibrating for their achievement level coming in).

In short, what was the impact on achievement of the push to close big high schools?

By: Gotham Gazette - The Wonkster » Blog Archive » The Education Campaign

Gotham Gazette - The Wonkster » Blog Archive » The Education Campaign — Wed, 23 Sep 2009 14:09:10 +0000

[...] indeed they do. But a study by Aaron Pallas of Columbia Teachers College and Jennifer Jennings of NYU finds that may be because [...]

By: Jeff S

Jeff S — Wed, 23 Sep 2009 12:59:51 +0000

Of course not….what causes a school to “fail” is not the caliber of the teachers or the Principals. Good students are what make good schools. If you for one second think that we can take the teachers at the Bronx High School of Science and bring them down to Thomas Jefferson High School and the kids at Jefferson would do better, you are very mistaken. Of course, the vast majority of students in the large high schools that the incompetent, uncertified and unqualified Joel Klein has closed for no reason whatsoever for generations served their communities and provided extra curricular activities which so much are supposed to be a part of the high school experience. I learned to play an instrument thanks to the band classes I had when I attended Erasmus Hall High School many moons ago. The large schools, of course, provide an opportunity to offer a large variety of classes something the small schools can’t do. And then again in each large high school, each department was led by a very qualified Assistant Principal who had to demonstrate he or she was a true educational leader, who had been in the trenches and understood what teachers face. Please somebody explain to me how a Principal, trained say in Social Studies, can properly observe a chemistry lesson and know whether or not the chemistry being taught is correct (the most important obligation, of course, of a high school teacher). There was no reason, as I said, to close the large high schools. If they had simply gotten rid of the few trouble makers, which is essentially what they did in organizing these new schools, the kids today would be getting a much better education. Another example of how Mr. Klein, a man who is in a positon for which he is unqualified (and I don’t think anybody can argue that) has gone about systematically destroying the school system. It will take a decade or more to repair the damage he has been allowed to do.