Backing her kid’s school, actress Cynthia Nixon joins UWS war

west side story

November 14, 2008

Backing her kid’s school, actress Cynthia Nixon joins UWS war

by Philissa Cramer

A resolution to move an Upper West Side middle school passed on Wednesday night, but not before Cynthia Nixon — “Sex and the City” actress, Alliance for Quality Education spokeswoman, and parent at the school — was shouted down briefly during a heated public comment session.

Nixon was stepping into a fight that has been raging on the Upper West Side for months. The fight began as a discussion about how to deal with overcrowding at public schools but has spiraled into a raging debate about class and race and privilege in Upper Manhattan. Confrontations have gotten incredibly emotional — and personal: On this site, a commenter posing as Cynthia Nixon’s fictional son, Brady, from “Sex and the City” accused his “mom” of hypocrisy. And parents at Nixon’s school, called the Center School, have charged another school’s parents with racism and class prejudice, citing postings from last January on the Urban Baby Web site that called Center School students “thugs.”

At issue is a plan that would move the Center School from its current home inside a larger elementary school on West 70th Street, PS 199. Supporters of the plan tout it as an easy way to relieve crowding at the elementary school, which is growing so quickly that parents fear it will not have room to hold their younger children. Opponents, including Nixon, argue that moving the Center School exacerbates segregation by race and class. (PS 199, a zoned school, is two-thirds white, while the Center School, which draws its students from throughout the district, is half white and has a higher proportion of black and Hispanic students.)

If the plan becomes official, which it almost certainly will after Wednesday’s vote, the Center School will move to another school building several blocks away.

Nixon and other Center School parents have vehemently opposed the plan for months, making fliers and using the school’s Web site to organize protests. They also delivered passionate testimony at the meeting Wednesday, choosing Nixon and another mother to represent their cause. In her short remarks, which I captured in the video above, Nixon argued that there is a stark difference between the demographic of the Center School and the “increasingly white and increasingly affluent” elementary school it shares space with. Moving the Center School away, she said, would lead to a “de facto segregated building on 70th Street.”

The Upper West Side school war began in September, when the city Department of Education suggested two plans for how the Upper West Side could relieve crowding.

One would have moved 30 percent of students to new schools. But the local parent council that has final authority over zoning matters last week indicated that it would back a much tamer plan. That one would move only a handful of students, keep siblings in the same school, and, most controversially, relocate two schools. One of those schools, Anderson, a gifted school that pulls students from across the city, agreed to a move. The other, the Center School, where Cynthia Nixon is a parent, has spent weeks fighting tooth and nail against the plan.

The people booing Nixon were led by a growing group of parents who are zoned for PS 199 but fear that increasing crowding could make the school too packed to have room for their children. If the Center School moves out of their building, that will shore up space for their children at PS 199. These parents, who have maintained a Web site that some say contains misinformation, turned out in large numbers to the meeting on Wednesday. (Below the jump, view a video of their spokesman, Eric Shuffler, speaking out at the meeting; he, too, was booed.)

But Nixon’s contingent was by far the largest. It included not only by Center School parents but also parents from at least four neighborhood schools, who echoed Nixon’s argument about diversity. The group walked out in protest as the council prepared to vote. A number of PS 199 parents who said they supported the Center School joined them.

Also walking out — at times to shouts of “Yes, we can” — were parents from the Computer School, a middle school whose building will be Anderson’s new home, and PS 75, a diverse elementary school whose zone was trimmed in the resolution.

Council members said they had no authority to involve issues of diversity in the rezoning process. “The [Community Education Council] does value diversity. We’ve talked about it,” CEC 3 member Jennifer Freeman told me after the meeting. “We were working with the tools available to us so the main topic in this conversation had to be overcrowding. We would welcome the opportunity to talk about diversity more.”

During the meeting, one council member explained that she wanted to deal with issues of race and class segregation in the district but that now was not the right time to do so.

“If not now, when?” audience members shouted at her.

That council member, Danielle Moss Lee, ultimately abstained from voting. She was the only council member present who did not vote in favor of the resolution.

310 Comments

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meredith fogel
November 14th, 2008 5:59 pm

It is disgraceful that any parent, principal, or celebrity could take the position that an unzoned middle school’s theoretical attachment to bricks and mortar trumps the needs of zoned elementary school children (some as young as 5) to go to their neighborhood school. Cynthia Nixon should stick to her day job, and the Center School should stop raising red-herrings in an effort to avoid the only logical and appropriate conclusion to an unfortunate overcrowding situation.
ps199 Parent
November 14th, 2008 8:13 pm

Ummmmmm……..let me see,affluent and white……and segregated like Cynthia Nixon HERSELF??!!!!!!!!!!!She wasn’t complaining when HER kids were going to 199,it wasn’t too “white”then…..(even tho’ as someone who has lived in the immediate neighborhood for over 1/2 my life…… 20+ yrs,my dh for even more the PS 199 demographic has not appreciably changed in the yrs since her kids went there………..but we HAVE LOST a computer room,music room,teachers lounge etc.)If she’s so worried about it being too “white and “rich”,she could afford to pay for private school for HER kids and perhaps let someone ,perhaps “white”,perhaps not,but someone who can’t afford her options take her children’s place,AND since the Center school is so concerned w/their class size ,PERHAPS SHE COULD EXPLAIN WHY IT’S OKAY FOR THE ps.199 5thGRADE TO HAVE 34 KIDS IN A CLASS ,BUT CENTER SCHOOL TO ONLY HAVE 23?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!DOES THIS HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH RACE??????????While center school parents were handing out leaflets about how overcrowded the school WOULD be if Center was forced to leave,I politely asked this and other questions,I was completely ignored.also,apparently Eleanor Swartz has promised a good portion of the fourth grade places w/Center if they take the Center School Side………..a great many more places than they even have,even if they took their ENTIRE fifth grade next yr from 199.
Look,I understand,no one likes change……..AND ………if it wasn’t an issue of overcrowding……………..AND if they didn’t have a place waiting for them 5 blocks away.I don’t find it unreasonable that middle schoolers are made to go an extra few blocks,most of our kids will and do,and even travel much further during middles chool……..I find it much more unreasonable that half of the current population now zoned for 199 -some like myself less than 2 blocks away ….would have to shlep our elementary school students to 161,over 10 blocks away.Undoubtedly,we would be told we were too “close” for bus service,(just like my son at another grade school far downtown is too “far” -yet.ironically,kids at private schools such as Spence are on buses paid for by tax dollars!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Urgh!)

Granted,as well,if a good deal of school gerrymandering hadn’t of gone on,such as promising a great deal of the new high rise co-ops &condos that have gone up in the past few years along Amsterdam,and also I believe,the Trump bldgs,that they would be zoned for PS 199, instead of ANOTHER school(seen as less desirous and less conducive to good real estate prices) that they were properly zoned for,perhaps this WOULDN’T have been a problem at all.

there are also other issues,and ?I could go on,but not all of us are rich,or able to afford private schools.we were the people who suddenly made the neighborhood a “great”place to live,who stayed when NO ONE wanted we should leave ,b/c we don’t fit some rich,yuppies and self absorbed ,has-been wanna-be politically correct actress ‘ idea of what makes suitable neighborhood school demographics.

You know I went to school w/”Cynthia Nixon,and she seemed like a self -imprtant full-of herself snot then.Looks like some things don’,t change much (it was Hunter,if you want to know…….and what she couldn’t use “pull” to get her kids in there when just their own native brains weren’.t enough,because believe me,gifted or not,?center knew exactly who SHE was when they invited her kids to go).

Thank you for hearing me,
A PS 199 parent
PS199 parent
November 14th, 2008 8:15 pm

It is disgraceful that any parent, principal or lobbyist could take a position that preschoolers who are sent 20-30 blocks away for their precious private preschools can’t go ten blocks away to a new elementary school at PS9. With their savings from preschool they could even take a cab. Their near hysterical whining about being within walking distance is dishonest a “red herring”. Which one of these Trump/Extel princes or princesses wouldn’t send their kids to Dalton if they could get in? Would they say no because it wasn’t within walking distance? Yeah right.

PS. all middle schools are unzoned for catchment. They are also all in elementary schools. This ridiculous argument would mean that anytime a elementary school got overcrowded they could move out a middle school.
PS199 parent
November 14th, 2008 8:55 pm

How did the head of the 199 PTA Valerie Watnick get into the school if the school is sooo overcrowded and she doesn’t live in the catchment? Guess she made a nice donation to that $450,000 that the PTA raised. Money talks. Hypocrites… walk.
199 has only 24 kids in their third grade classes. That’s how many in mine. And Nixon’s kids did not go to 199. They went to the school with the trailers uptown. Maybe we should get some trailers too.
Let’s at least get our facts straight or else we sound like idiots.
Beth Marcus
November 14th, 2008 8:58 pm

Am I ever glad this is our last year at PS 199. The Center School people ( who worked the system to get their PS 199 kids into Center School for most of their time at PS 199) have always been self-centered and duplicitious. Having the “carrot” of a coveted and very rare spot at Center School has been a corrupting influence as long as we have been at PS 199. And now we find they are sore losers as well.
A plea from a Trump/Extell Prince
November 14th, 2008 10:06 pm

My lieges, I beseech thee: my carriage wheels rust; my armor is no longer shiny and new; my plate is full of broccoli. I am 4 years old and very much want to attend the public school down the block. Alas, for this wont of an education I am branded an insufferable elitist dandy, a fop, aye, even a racist. I’m told t’is best to be shipped off to some far away land, so that the Knights of the Center Table may remain. I apologize profusely for living by the river - perhaps I shall go drown myself in it to alleviate the suffering of others.
Uncle Matt
November 14th, 2008 10:13 pm

O come on. Cynthia Nixon epitomizes the Center School parent– rich, connected, powerful and indebted to Elaine Schwartz. Fact is her young boy is now at PS87. Why? Cause she rented an apartment above C’Esca at market price (a pittance to Ms. Nixon I should add) specifically he goes there. She has been quoted in the press as saying so. Not unlike the PS199 parents who moved to their neighborhoods to send their kids to PS199. Isn’t it amazing how Cythia enjoys the basic right of sending her child to his catcment school but speaks out against children of the PS199 catchment having that right. The only difference is that many PS199 parents have chosen to live house poor whereas Cynthia Nixon is flush with cash.
Should I name the many other affluent and connected parents at Center School I know of who talk out both sides of their mouths as they milk the public school system? Why aren’t these white and rich Center School parents in private schools? They are depriving truly needy and deserving kids a space in public middle schools and dividing a community cause their autocratic and geriatric director tells them to.
Red Herring?
November 14th, 2008 10:20 pm

Perhaps the Center School parents are the true racists here for wanting to stay in a “predominantly white, affluent” neighborhood? Isn’t that how they refer to it? Yet they seem to be particularly reluctant to move.
Uncle Matt
November 14th, 2008 10:31 pm

Of course Center School Parents are the racists. And shameless eletists. Elaine Schwartz literally hand picks everyone at that school based on the families, not the kids. From the hollywood agent who will give more business to her daughter Julie (a casting director) to her Grandson’s friends, to the PS199 parents promised a spot in exchange for speaking out against relocation of the center school. How a public school could be allowed to function in such an exclusive and aristocratic fashion is an outrage. Schwartz is using MY tax dollars to build HER empire.
Andy Wolf
November 15th, 2008 6:07 am

It is amazing how these parochial issues generate so much controversy. But learn from history, my friends.

During the 1950s and 1960s tremendous effort was made in NYC and most other big cities to desegregate — didn’t work. Arguably it was the root cause of the segregation we see today. Remember, even though NYC is nearly half white, the public schools are 85% minority. And by the standards of most big cities, that is a very high percentage of whites remaining in public school.

If you want to build better schools, the answer lies in the symbiotic relationship between neighborhood and school. Parents of all races want, even demand neighborhood schools. Take it away and the neighborhood will suffer and the school will follow.

If Cynthia Nixon wants to send her kids to a diverse school, then she should move to a diverse neighborhood. No child should be turned away from their neighborhood school so that some elitist can insure that their kids are in the right “mix” to assuage their liberal guilt.

Social engineering doesn’t work. In 1967 Jonathan Kozol gained his reputation by writing of the school he taught in in Boston as being “segregated.” Just how segregated was it really? 60 percent black, 40 percent white, figures that Kozol doesn’t mention.

Kozol advocated for forced busing for Boston, a remedy embraced by the courts there and elsewhere. Soon his school fulfilled his fantasy image — it really WAS segregated. In fact, soon there was NO school in Boston that was 40 percent white. Tens of thousands of white students left the public school system. Are the children of Boston better off for Kozol’s social engineering? I don’t think so.
Mike M
November 15th, 2008 2:00 pm

If one were to look at the numbers, it would make sense to actually redraw the zone line between PS 199 and PS 191. The southern part of 199’s district should be changed to go to PS 191. PS 199 is overcrowded and PS 191 still has openings for its Kindergarten registry. I know this will also upset people because they don’t want their kids going to school with the kids from the projects. Isn’t that racism right there? Inevitably, it does come down to PS 199 parents being racist, doesn’t it?
Red Herring
November 15th, 2008 4:54 pm

Hi. Guess who’s back? Me - the red herring! I decided to swim back into a somewhat logical argument and muddy the waters.

No, racism has nothing to do with it.

Turns out that 191 is a C school, and 199 is an A school (one of the best in the city, in fact). Guess that parents who want their kids to get a good education are racists.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense - to a fish, perhaps.
Another Herring
November 15th, 2008 5:06 pm

Hmmm, racism again, huh? Easy to throw that word around, Mike M., to scare people and distract them from the real issues. I guess wanting to go to one of the best schools in the city isn’t a good enough reason. I guess buying a piece of property in an area 10 years ago to be ready to send your children to the great school just doesn’t cut it. No, that’s just a guise. The real issue is that we — a family of mixed heritage — are really racist deep down inside. Yup. We don’t want our Hispanic/Middle Eastern child to mix with any other folks. Nope. But PLEASE don’t let people know that. We had gotten so far actually convincing the DOE that we really just wanted a good school for our 4 year old. Don’t out us. Shhhh…..
PS 199 parent
November 15th, 2008 8:50 pm

Is it elitist or racist if you live in the cachment and want your children to have the education and space in a school for which your high property taxes are paying? The bottom line is that the kids who live in the PS199 cachment need more space in their school, and the space is there but is being used by the Center School. It worked for the Center school to be there for a long time when there was enough space at 199 for all the families. PS 199 is outgrowing its own space, and the time has come for Center to move. There is space at PS 9 for Center School, but perhaps the Center School parents don’t want their children to be that close to the Brandeis High School (a mostly minority school). Oh wait…I am wrong, Center wants diversity. But only the diverse mix that they choose? Yes, the kids (and families) who go to Center are hand picked by Elaine and family. If you looked at the number of PS 199 kids who were admitted to Center the same year that her grandchildren came into Center, you would see quite an increase those two years. And if it helps her family, then they are in! And somewhere a Center parent or administrator commented that if they had to move from 199 that they wouldn’t admit as many, or perhaps any, 199 kids. It doesn’t surprise me that they would allow this to affect the kids. If Center moves, then the only 199 families who have a chance of getting into Center will be those who supported Center not moving. So show your allegience now if you want any kind of future at Center. Maybe Elaine Schwartz dosen’t want to give up her parking spot in the driveway of PS199. Offer her a parking spot at PS 9 and that will seal the deal.
Julia
November 15th, 2008 10:04 pm

I’m not knowledgeable about this issue, but I do know that the Center school operates in a very closed manner. I well remember my futile efforts to get information about the Center school and its application process. We had moved to New York when my daughter was in the third grade. She was in PS 87 and when I heard about the Center School, I thought I’d like to know more about whether this might be a good option for her. I naively called the school. No luck, they wouldn’t even answer the phone. I kept trying and finally someone did answer. I asked about the application process and she said she had no time to reply. I said, “But I don’t want to keep you on the phone. I want only a two-minute response. What do we do to submit an application? And do you have a brochure describing the school?” The woman replied with great irritation that SHE HAD NO TIME, SHE WAS VERY BUSY. I said, “But aren’t you a public school? Don’t you have application procedures?” She would not respond. I still remember the sense of futility, of powerlessness, dealing with this arrogant person who would not even explain how one might go about learning about the school–maybe even visiting it?–and applying. I realized that this school served the connected. The rest of us could forget it.
Robert
November 16th, 2008 12:46 pm

ps199 Parent
said: You know I went to school w/”Cynthia Nixon,and she seemed like a self -imprtant full-of herself snot then.Looks like some things don’,t change much (it was Hunter,if you want to know…….and what she couldn’t use “pull” to get her kids in there when just their own native brains weren’.t enough,because believe me,gifted or not,?center knew exactly who SHE was when they invited her kids to go).

Thank you for hearing me,
A PS 199 parent

I have to say, your personal attacks against your opponent make me think she probalby has the better point of view. It always happens that those with the crappy arguments tend to attack the personal lives of those they disagree with. Thanks for showwing everyone what little values and morals you hold. You make Ms. Nixon’s points for her. But to be honest, If I were her, I’d want my children as far away from people like you as I could get.
PS199 parent
November 16th, 2008 12:58 pm

“Elaine Schwartz created a private-school quality public school in an era where you could not pay most families to stay in NYC.”
Uncle Matt

Everything else sounds like sour grapes.
Uncle Matt
November 16th, 2008 1:30 pm

I am so sorry you find the truth to be painful “PS199 Parent”. No sour grapes here. Just cold hard facts. Or do all those parents I named not have their over priveleged kids at the Center Schoo.
You center school folk have set the worst example for your kids and the community. You have tought your kids to win at all costs and put winning first, above ethics and the greater good. Too bad you could’t teach your kids gratitude. After all, you have been sharing space in PS199 for all these years, and the past several at the detriment of PS199. You crossed the line between guest and squatter long ago. We should quit squandering city tax dollars on your cult and put in an honest director.
BB
November 16th, 2008 1:42 pm

You 199 parents should be ashamed of yourselves. You are worse than the worst political campaign. You are spouting lies for your own gains. You are naming names like a witch hunt. And the fact that you are naming children and putting them at risk is reason enough that all you are asking for should be denied.
SHAME ON YOU!
robin r
November 16th, 2008 1:46 pm

Goodness, gracious the 199 parent who said you needed to get your facts right, lest you look like idiots….too late. The person who left the rant on Nov. 14, at 8:13 p.m.–wow. You know, I spend 1 and 1/2 hours, twice daily, taking my children to their prospective schools. What’s best for them is not always the most convenient for me. And I work. As a teacher. When you said you had to schlep 10 blocks, I sincerely laughed out loud. Then I remembered my own Wyoming childhood. One public school. Children who lived in Moose had to get on the bus at 6 in the morning to make it to Jackson by 7. There were some kids who snowmobiled in and out of their ranches, just to meet the bus. 10 blocks. Personal attacks on others, well-known or not. Thank God I don’t live anywhere near you. My children are busy learning what is really important. Living, no matter what the challenges. What are you representing today?
jim white
November 16th, 2008 10:16 pm

So, now Ms. Nixon has another issue….looks like an agenda developing for a possible run for some office…school board?, city council?, state senate? In these matters..the kids best interest come first!
Fiorastar
November 16th, 2008 10:43 pm

Just thought you might all want to know that Huffington Post has picked up this story, so your very personal attacks have now gone very public–nationwide (actually worldwide). It may or may not matter to each person posting that there are names being named and people being publicly attacked, but at least try to consider that, regardless of what you personally think about, or envy as the case may be, the adults involved, there are children who go to both these schools and your modeling of “adult” ways to problem solve within a community is showing them how it’s done. Hopefully, they will learn from your mistakes rather than imitating you.
maryann
November 16th, 2008 10:45 pm

Everyone is entitled to their opinion and perspective - but I have to agree, naming names and slandering children and families is just appalling. If you can’t stick to the issues, then maybe you don’t really have an argument. It says a whole lot more about you than the person you are slandering. Each side of this issue has very valid points; and the people speaking out have an absolute right to. Shame on the DOE for letting things get to this heated point. No one here wins except for the developers. PS 199 was a great school - and we’ve lost that. Center School was been a haven for city middle-schoolers that were lucky enough to get in to the 45 slots available each year (that explains all the sour grapes, really). Each will have to change - thanks to greedy developers, who advertised to families to move into their 199-catchment apartments, when in reality, their buildings were never even on a zoning map.
There’s more high rises to come…and the CEC/DOE is ensuring they go to our A school.
Confused on the Upper West Side
November 16th, 2008 10:50 pm

Can someone explain to me, in very simple terms, why the Center School is so opposed to moving out of the building. What do they care about PS 199? There is no interaction between the schools. And don’t say diversity because clearly that’s not the issue (why would CS care what diversity they add to PS 199 anyway?). Is this really just a matter of inconvenience? Because the hatred and diviseness stemming from this situation has gone to an extreme.
Bob Franklin
November 16th, 2008 11:01 pm

I am so glad I don’t have anything to do with this because all the parents on both sides sound like idiots. Why do the inane ones always multiply?
Deanna in NC
November 16th, 2008 11:09 pm

I don’t know the details of this argument, but I do know a bunch of squawking, out of line hens and roosters when I see them. Settle down, work this out like adults (and no, “they did it first” is not a decent excuse for anyone, not even a five year old), and stop setting such a bad example for the kiddies.

In other words, act like adults.
199 parent
November 16th, 2008 11:14 pm

NY1 has a more accurate version of the issue at hand. It is NOT about race. It is NOT about segregation. It is about space and numbers. Plain and simple. To make it into an issue about race is a diversion tactic. They simply just don’t want to move.
Horace B
November 16th, 2008 11:15 pm

move to a gated community if that’s what you seek
upperwestsider
November 16th, 2008 11:20 pm

If I recall, didn’t Cynthia Nixon try to get her child into this “whit and affluent” school? It was good enough for her until she was REJECTED! sour grapes?
199
November 16th, 2008 11:28 pm

Oh and you might want to add that the reason the Center School contingent was so big was because they brought their kids- which include relatives of their principal and their friends.
PS 199 Parent
November 16th, 2008 11:29 pm

I attended this meeting and was shocked to see Cynthia Nixon use a class warfare argument to support the Center school’s refusal to move to another location on the upper westside. What is the big deal for the school to move? On New York One Cynthia claimed that moving the school would be disruptive to her child’s eight grade school year. The principal of the Center School states that the harm would be that graduated students would not be able to find their old school. That one was my personal favorite..oh the danger of teenagers looking for their old middle school wandering the upper westside in search of the Center School. The Center School is being offered more space and I think thats the real reason that the School doesnt want to move…. more space means no capping for the Center School which translates to having to admit more children and then they too may be forced to have 34 kids in a class just as the students of PS 199’s current fifth grade. The Center School has 23 kids per class. You do the math…34 kids versus 23 kids kids per class. Which school has the greater need? Why is it more complicated than that. …..because a celebrity says so and that makes for a good story.
Former Center School Parent
November 16th, 2008 11:37 pm

I cannot believe the vitriolic attacks against The Center School and Elaine Schwartz. This is just sad. I’m not sure where some of you have gotten your “facts” but as far as admissions are concerned -applications for the CS (when my child applied in 2001) where given out at the elementary schools. We had to ask the principal at the elementary school for an application - and she didn’t want to give it to us because they don’t want to lose 5th graders. We knew no one at Center School; we had no connections; Parents were not interviewed. The kids spent a morning attending a class with a “buddy” who was a current student. The school takes kids at grade level, above grade level, and below grade level. And then they teach them. This school has been in the same building for 26 years. They should not have to go through the upheaval and stress of moving up to the west 80s. It’s sad that NYC has allowed developers to come in and build large residential buildings without making any accomodations for the influx of children. Consequently, they are pitting parent against parent. The fact is parents, students, teachers, and even principals are the low men on the totem pole. Developers and Bloomberg/Klein have the power. There are not enough schools for the influx of children into District 3 because of overdevelopment. The elementary school seat shortage will in a few years be a middle school seat shortage. What school will you force out then? Oh, and one more thing - the characterizations of Elaine Schwartz are FALSE. In all our years at the school I never once saw Ms. Schwartz behave in any way that was unethical. She always put the kids first. I am proud that my child was a Center School student. And you people who are saying such hateful things should be ashamed of yourselves. You started trying to push the school out last year - not two weeks ago. And considering how much money the PS 199 PTA raises (which is way more money than we could ever have hoped to raise at CS) one would have to conclude that the true moneyed crowd goes to PS 199. Sure we’ve had a few celebrities over the years at CS but there are way more parents like my spouse and myself - an office manager and an adjunct professor at a community college. Not heavy hitters nor politically connected. Just grateful that our child had the opportunity to attend the school that 1. saved them from 5th grade in an awful elementary school and 2. gave them the skills needed to succeed in a specialized high school. Maybe that’s why alumni and former parents were at the meeting and are speaking up now. This school is a really special place and it is unfair that they be forced to move after 25 years. Shame on you all.
PS199 parent
November 16th, 2008 11:42 pm

We have 24 kids in our third grade class at 199 a very reasonable number. Can someone in simple terms explain to me why we want 200 more elementary school children using our facilities? We only get library for 15 minutes per week now as it is? What will happen with 200 more kids? Why when every school in the city wants to be Smaller we want to be BIGGER? This is the problem - if no one can explain this then maybe we have to ask ourselves what the real reason we want them out is?
PS199 parent
November 16th, 2008 11:46 pm

PS 199 PTA raised $450,000. in one year for 600 kids. That says it all.
Uncle Matt
November 16th, 2008 11:46 pm

Once again, no sour grapes here. As a parent I think it would be as irresponsible to send my chidren to the Center School as it would have been to send them to the Branch Dividians or Jonestown. As for naming names, can someone from the Center School PLEASE explain to me why Alan Madison hides the fact that he is Elaine’s son in law and that his kids attend the school? And for that matter PRETTY PLEASE explain to me how it is appropriate that his kids and their friends get to go to the school???
Lemme guess– cause their PTA loses credibility when it is “in the fmaily” and it is entirely inapprporiate for Elaine to fill slots with her grandkids and their friends. Notice no Center School parent has defendedd these practices. They have just said “Oh how could you name students shame on you.” They are on facebook for goodness sake. Public knowledge. And how could the Center School accost and verbally assault PS199 parents outside the school and on the playground. This happens all the time now.

Again, no sour grapes by me. My kids are toddlers. And I assure you Center School is on my embargo list and it should be for any other parent who eschews brainwashing. How could I be jealous? I feel sorry for you.
PS 199 Parent
November 16th, 2008 11:50 pm

Uncle Matt you are funny and dead on.
Former Center School Parent
November 16th, 2008 11:57 pm

Seriously - “Branch Davidians or Jonestown?” That is just absurd and shows just how little you actually know about The Center School. What a sad, sad man you are.
PS199 parent
November 17th, 2008 12:01 am

Liar liar pants on fire Uncle Matt. Your kid is not a toddler. And it is just sour grapes.
Center School Alum
November 17th, 2008 12:02 am

I just have to say that I am disgusted at all these personal attacks against Ms. Schwartz. When I was at Center she was like a another grandmother to me and every single student around me. She knew everyone, was concerned for everyone’s well being, and wanted everyone to succeed in their life, even after Center. When I first applied to Center, I had never heard of the Center School before, neither did my parents. On top of that, neither my parents nor I had ever heard of Elaine Schwartz. During my four years receiving a top-notch education she never tried to indoctrinate us with secret plans and she definitely DID NOT have a goal to create some kind of evil regime. To compare her to the likes of Jim Jones is sickening and false. On the contrary, Ms. Schwartz, is probably one of the most loving and caring person I have ever met, she cared for me and my peers with all her heart and always wanted the best for us.
Jason Q - in the hinterlands of Nebraska
November 17th, 2008 12:03 am

From the perspective of a guy who has a kindergartener and 3rd-grader in school out here in the great unknown (AKA anything west of Yonkers), I must say this strikes me as exceedingly bizarre. Am I reading this right - public schools that pick and choose their students? Srsly? And here I thought that the way it was depicted in shows like “Law & Order” couldn’t possibly be the way it really was. More fool me.
PS 199 Parent
November 17th, 2008 12:11 am

I have a great idea. If such a fair system for one person to hand pick the students who get to attend a PUBLIC SCHOOL lets have the DOE way in and explain it to us. Center School open up your admission practices for review by the DOE. Sibling, friends, grandchildren??? With public funds I dont think so.
Horace B
November 17th, 2008 12:25 am

ps199 parent:

the only thing worse than your inaccuracies are your manners. being truthful is a skill some of us take for granted. however, it is easy to master. but we sometimes forget that there are “challenged” persons in this world who find this to be difficult. slamming ms schwartz with dishonesty is kind of sleazy. sort of like parking in a handicap space. i wish you the best of luck with the anger, and double talk that seem to be placing such a demand on you.
Mandy
November 17th, 2008 12:44 am

It amazes me to see so many people calling Cynthia Nixon a hypocrite for doing what she thinks is right. At least she is taking the time to stand up for something that matters, regardless of whether or not you agree with her stance. High profile people can’t win- if they send their children to private school they are elitist. If they send them to public schools they are “depriving another child” of that space in the school. People are seething with jealousy at her success and can’t even see the plain truth of her words. How sad.
UWSMom
November 17th, 2008 1:02 am

Well, I see the chickens have come home to roost. 7 years ago when my family moved back into the city one of the schools we applied to was this one. At the time I was surprised at the intensity of the parents going to the open house and filling out the applications. It’s like they felt it was first come first served. Mostly I was down right offended by the application. A huge portion of the application focused on the parents. What their occupation was and what the could bring to the school (really!). I was appalled. This is a PUBLIC SCHOOL. What does it matter what the parent does??? If a single mom or a *gasp* welfare mom came an applied because she had the wherewithal to find information on schools and wanted a sound education for her child she would be rejected??? Because she doesn’t have time or a skill she can pimp out to the school? Look outside yourselves and think about it.
disgusted
November 17th, 2008 1:25 am

PS 199 is a good school, The Center School is a good school. Can we start by agreeing on that? Does everyone want their child in the school that works best for them? Yes, I think we can agree on that. Does everyone want every school to work for all of our children? I hope so. I’m glad that 199 has managed to keep class sizes small (below cap numbers for public schools in NY). I’m glad that the parents are involved and can provide extras for some of the students there.

But can we not learn a lesson from our recent election? There are valid points and concerns from all sides, and even parents at 199 that don’t want The Center School to be forced out. Can we not come to the table in a positive way to work something out? Yes we can. Can we come together with parents from other schools, and work this hard on cutting class sizes all over the city? Yes we can. Can we not have a discussion without calling out people’s kids and grandkids? Yes, we can. Can we teach our children through example, and respect? Yes we can.

Now if Will.i.am will just do a video, I could get this on youtube.

Finally, just to set the record straight. Elaine Schwartz started The Center School 26 years ago because she saw a need for good middle schools in this city. She didn’t start it for her kids (they were all out of middle school) or her grandchildren (not born yet). She didn’t start it for her friends and neighbors. She reaches out to every community in the city to bring all kinds of kids together. If you have worked with middle school age children, or have tried to find a good middle school for you children, you know how hard it is. Go ahead visit some schools. You will not find a harder working, more dedicated principal or staff.

Our city, state, and country are facing rough economic times. We will have to forge ahead with less than ideal circumstances, and much less funding than needed. Attacking good schools, principals, teachers, and students doesn’t help. Attacking parents who want the best they can give their children doesn’t help.

Can’t New Yorkers do better? Yes we can.
Upset parent about the behavior and lies spread by the Center School
November 17th, 2008 8:13 am

you center school parents must think if you make things up and say them loud enough that they are right.

What a showing you had of storming out the other night of the CEC meeting when it went to a vote–talk about the election process–you are such poor examples for your children no wonder you are concerned about their school education.
THis is not a fight over diversity–and there are many people that are not affluent and are struggling to get by that attend 199–to move the school creates a huge hardship for working people. Your kids can commute to school themselves and most if not all already do. 199 needs space. Our kids deserve to go to their neighborhood school. Stop the insanity–think about something greater than yourselves the community, our young children. And the next time you want to call us affluent people with connections-think twice about showcasing Cynthia Nixon front and center at the meeting with her quecard read.
Uncle Matt
November 17th, 2008 8:57 am

Ok Center School. Keep victimizing yourselves and Ms. Schwartz. I guess her email yesterday about disparaging blogs was code to do that. Write more blogs to that extent and maybe the world will believe you, or at the very least forget all the many facts that have been recited in my posts and those of others who have pointed out the Center schools hyprocrasy.
In the meantime, the issue remains what it is– Elaine Schwartz, just doesn’t want to interrupt her life. So she doesn’t want to move. So she has her minions blinding marching to battle for her even though they stand to gain much better facilities in their new location.
It is PS199 who has been victimized by Center School– kids stuffed in classes approaching 30 students in size while the Center School sits fat and happy on the whole third floor enjoying classes of 12-18. SHAME ON YOU!
et
November 17th, 2008 9:00 am

To all of you posting, greeting from back woods of New Mexico what a joke so good to see the pettiness, small mindness, etc… of NYC’s supposed winners ha ha ha. It is always so enjoyable to see what brings out the best in folk. To an outsider the real questions is, Who would want to raise their children in that human sink hole called NYC!
Superhifan
November 17th, 2008 9:03 am

I live in a suburb of Washington, DC. What’s with the competitiveness of schools in New York? I’ve heard there is a real dog eat dog mentality when it comes so both private and public schools in New York. Why?
PS199 parent
November 17th, 2008 9:09 am

Again - Uncle Matt - we have 24 kids in our third grade class at PS 199. Center School has 1/2 floor. 8 rooms. They as we do teach in the hall. Get your facts straight. At least one!

We at 199 DO NOT want another 200 elementary kids in our playground, cafeteria, hallways!

And start telling the truth about yourself instead of hiding behind a phony name. Underemployed with plenty of time to blog. Child who did not get into Center School - remember the acorn doesn’t fall far from the tree. And sick to his stomach from eating SOUR GRAPES!
judgejudy
November 17th, 2008 9:13 am

Great point Mandy. Talk about no win situation. Everyone can criticize few can do.
199er
November 17th, 2008 9:14 am

PLEASE someone explain to me why we want another 200-250 kids at 199??? we can barely have drop off!!! Pick up is a disaster. Please someone explain!!!
without yelling or being nasty. Just a simple explanation of why??
Superhifan
November 17th, 2008 9:14 am

Maybe the greater argument is why is a public school accepting applications? I’ve never heard of such a thing. Also, children should be able to attend schools in their neighborhood period. They should not have to be inconvenienced because those not living in the neighborhood want their children to attend the school. The sacrifice should be made by those that live outside the neighborhood. The issue of diversity should not be the benchmark here, however, if parents are demonizing children of color in this process by calling them thugs, shame on you. All people should want for others what they desire for themselves; in this case, a better education for all.
InwoodWhiteChick
November 17th, 2008 9:21 am

W. 70th Street is not “Upper Manhattan.” Since Manhattan goes up into the 220’s, it most likely be called lower Manhattan. Upper Manhattan has tons of diversity, so we don’t have to fight about it around here.
another 199
November 17th, 2008 9:27 am

I agree — someone explain to me why we want another 200-250 kids at 199??? we can barely have drop off!!! Pick up is a disaster. all true. don’t get me started about the lack of a school play.
a simple explanation of why??
Hypocrite Alert
November 17th, 2008 9:55 am

Those of you Center School parents who say the 199 community should be ashamed of itself for wanting the Center School to move — one question for you: Are you the same parents who casually throw around the words “racist” and “segregationist” when you see your position slipping away?
199 parent and NOT a racist or segregationist
November 17th, 2008 10:22 am

LET THE NUMBERS SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES!
God, I am so tired of this issue. Cynthia Nixon tried hard to get her youngest child into 199, though she doesn’t live in the catchment. Why? For the convenience of dropping both kids off at one building. Truly, I know this firsthand.
Making this about racism is a real red herring. Unfortunately, the 199 catchment has changed significantly in recent years and has become significantly less diverse. Prior to the overcrowing, there were more children coming from other catchments, which brought more diversity to the school. Now that the school is so overcrowded (And Cynthia’s wacky statement that it’s the the sixth most crowded in the district is simply incorrect, as John White, DOE official, pointed out after she stopped talking) there is no room for those outside the catchment. Still, 199 is 22 percent African American and Hispanic. Not perfectly diverse, but not lily-white.
According to the DOE, there won’t be sufficient room for catchment children next year. The school is in crisis.
Center is NOT a catchment school; it can be located anywhere in the district.
Having diversity at Center School does not make 199 more diverse. The two school communities have almost nothing to do with each other.

And I’m not even addressing Elaine Schwartz’s admissions tactics, which are highly questionable.
Center School parent
November 17th, 2008 10:27 am

I want a new space for the center school kids and let PS199 have the building to meet their space needs. I am tired of having classes that are taught in the stairways and closets. I find it disgusting for other center school parents claiming “RACISM” . That is absolute BULLSHIT and should stop. Let’s move on and let PS199 and their community have the best education for their kids and we will grow in a new space
I love ps199
November 17th, 2008 10:31 am

What the Center School parents do not want to accept is that PS 199 is going to get bigger - with the Center School or without them. WE DON’T WANT TO GET BIGGER - OBVIOUSLY- BUT WE HAVE NO CHOICE. You only need to look at the enormous buildings going up in our catchment to realize the magnitude of the upcoming explosion. Think about it -when you have 2 5th grade classes leaving and 7 kindergarten classes coming in these children have to get seats as they move their way up to 5th grade. Without the Center School leaving it is impossible to accomplish. I am sorry that Cynthia Nixon’s daughter will be upset that she has to move in her critical 8th grade year. But you would rather bus 5 YEAR OLD’s to another school so she won’t get teary to MOM? You can’t be serious.
I am sure Center School will thrive in their new home and I wish them good luck.
Educators?
November 17th, 2008 10:36 am

Center School parents: You might not realize it, but your dialogue actually shows a lack of support for the quality of education at your school. Do you really have such low standards for your educators at the CS that you think the school will be destroyed if its four walls are different? I’m sure the CS is a great school, but do you think the physical space on West 70th Street is what makes it so, or the quality of the educators and directors? Or the support of the parents? Let’s back up and realize — all that will remain at another location. I would gladly send my soon-to-be Kindergartener to any location in the city if I knew the strong teachers and directors from PS 199 would be there as well. It’s about the quality of the educators, not the actual physical space.
maryann
November 17th, 2008 10:59 am

According to the PS 199 Executive Board, the reason they welcome another 200-250 kindergarteners to the school is the money they will bring. Big donations from eager new families is what makes 199 so cash-rich.
I love ps199
November 17th, 2008 11:19 am

Maryann- your logic is specious at best. Although you attempt to show your ‘inside’ knowledge you are totally off base with the facts. For example, last year we only had about a 40% participation in the pledge drive but yet we had to give money for 100% of the children. More children mean dilution of those funds. I really wish I could just encounter ONE Center School advocate who could focus on the issues - not fundrasing or racism or wealth BUT SPACE. But as you lose the argument it always comes back to those issues.
Sarah Palin
November 17th, 2008 11:29 am

Class warfare and culture wars didn’t work for me during the campaign - it won’t work for you. People are smarter than that. Stick to the issue at hand.
Blossom
November 17th, 2008 11:31 am

maryann, how do you know that? I am not a 199 parent, but I am a member of the Executive Board in my son’s school, and our meetings aren’t public. Are 199 Executive Board meetings public? Or is this a rumor out there?
maryann
November 17th, 2008 11:35 am

I’m going to have to ask Sarah what specious means - probably special, right?
I love ps199
November 17th, 2008 11:45 am

Having the ring of truth or plausibility but actually fallacious: a specious argument
I LOVE PS 199 ALSO
November 17th, 2008 11:52 am

SPECIOUS :apparently good or right though lacking real merit; superficially pleasing or plausible: specious arguments
plausible but not true; based on pretense; sophistic
disgusted
November 17th, 2008 12:48 pm

Once again, are personal attacks against families and staff helpful? And look again at class size. I don’t know the specific numbers at 199, but I’ve read people talking about 24 -30 kids in a class.

NYC schools are capped at 25 for K, and 32 for grades 1-5 (not including CTT and self contained special ed classes) with exceptions to go over those caps.

Yes, 24 kids in a 3rd grade is a good number. But with many other schools with 8-10 more students per class, how does that make 199 the overlooked, over crowded school?

Please say what you mean: you enjoy sending your children to a good school with manageable class sizes. It is in no way the Center Schools fault that the city has planned and zoned the way it has.
Another 199 parent who is not racist or segregationist
November 17th, 2008 1:28 pm

24 kids in third grade is a perfectly fine number. The first grades have 27, which is rather high and the upper grades (4,5) are 30 or more. I think one of the 5th grades is 34. That said, these numbers are significantly higher than the numbers promised by Bloomberg.
And the big issue is what next year will bring. If there were 7 kindergartens this year, there’s the possibility of 8 next year (in the past 5 years, the school has gone from 4 Ks to 7–a rather quick and dramatic increase) and the school is literally out of rooms if K numbers hold steady or increase.
No one blames the Center School for the DOE’s ridiculously poor planning. It’s largely the specious (that word again!) use of the emotionally charged terms racist and segregationist that has 199 parents so upset.
ex nyc kid
November 17th, 2008 1:45 pm

wow. i was once the product of these social engineering programs and fights. the king will always need a boot maker, a jester, a bard, a queen, a soldier, an indoctrinator, and a guillotine. the king will always need a merchant and a money changer.

in plain english. keep indoctrinating your children into the rat race. keep pressuring them into school and degrees of alleged knowledge. keep feeding the machine.

who runs the show? who prints the money? we never know…keep segregating, keep this pagan cycle going under the auspices of human behavior, whether on purpose or not.

keep fighting against each other. our great gotham is now a joke. a bleeding giant. be sure to dust off those bachelors and masters degrees when the economy tanks even more and a college education finally becomes irrelevant (with the exception of those in the medical, high science and engineering fields).

keep filling the city with stupid, silver spoon, racist, idiots who always tilt the table to even the field out.

keep joining secret clubs, attend secret meetings and perpetuate the miserable human condition.

keep worshipping false idols, fake ancient stories and keep putting elitist sociopaths in power.

bush is a saint compared to the hierarchy that runs NYC Education, Finance, and Human Resources.

You treasonous idiots fail to see that all our faits are intertwined. Keep feeding the machine, one day, it will eat you too!
ex nyc kid
November 17th, 2008 1:52 pm

oops, i meant Fates!
ex nyc kid
November 17th, 2008 1:52 pm

i guess its that lauded nyc edumacation…
another 199
November 17th, 2008 2:24 pm

It isn’t about the race it’s about the SPACE!! If that is true according to our own stats we will be filled up again next year. What is our long term plan? NONE.
NO ONE answers the question: WHY does 199 want 200 - 250 more kids in a school that already has lines on the swings? No school play. When will lunch be? Can someone answer the question, when every school in the nation wants to get SMALLER we are lobbying to get bigger.
Me
November 17th, 2008 2:25 pm

Walking is not the issue, the issue is over-crowding along with diversity. The Center school will be removed from it’s home into another school which already contains three other middle schools, IS 245 The Computer School, MS 244 Columbus Middle School, and MS/IS 44 The Middle School for Science, Technology, and the Arts. The Computer School just recently left the gloomy basement of this same building to receive their own floor just to have to share their space with another school. And when this school gets over crowded what will happen then? When does the cycle end? I also believe in diversity and District 3 as a whole rallied for the right to make their schools more diverse [to end majority white schools] to take this right away by circumventing this choice would be ignorant.
inside out
November 17th, 2008 2:27 pm

another 199 There is no logical answer to that unless it is the money brought up above or the race thing… I guess in these situations you “follow the money.”
Diversity Numbers
November 17th, 2008 3:05 pm

Explain to me how PS 199 will no longer be diverse if Center School leaves? If you look at insideschools.org, you’ll see that while CS is more diverse in terms of black students, it’s not very different otherwise (almost the same % of Hispanic students, even fewer % of Asians at the CS). And that is the composition of the catchment. If the DOE wants to change diversity levels at all city schools, that’s fine, but then the entire system needs to change, not just PS 199. That is why this is a red herring. CS is just using race as a distraction from their point, which is that they just don’t want to move.
disgusted
November 17th, 2008 3:27 pm

Another 199 parent wrote above that the classroom numbers are higher the Bloomberg promised. Really, a politician promised something he couldn’t do? Remember Bloomberg got the referendum on requiring smaller class sizes removed from the ballot a few years ago. But maybe instead of spending his billions to run again, he could build some more schools.
diversity lies
November 17th, 2008 4:12 pm

If you move the CS out the diversity of the building goes down because the spots left empty by the CS will be filled by white student. I imagine CS would move if you recombined 191 and 199 together as they originally were built. THEN you would have two integrated buildings. You would improve 2 schools! 191 by way of adding wealthy parents and 199 by making it diverse. If you combine 191 & 199 you have 2 schools that are representative of the neighborhood from 59th to 70th! Instead of 199PTA having raised $450,000. in one year. They would have $225,000. and 191 would have that as well. this is a win win. Except for Center school that would move anyway but would not be able to play the race”card”. IF This is not about RACE? then why don’t 199 parents want to go to 191? Because it is sooooo far away? Please.
don't get it
November 17th, 2008 4:16 pm

Please someone answer the question - WHY do we want 200 - 250 more kids in a school that already has lines on the swings? No school play. When will lunch be? Can someone answer the question, when every school in the nation wants to get SMALLER we are lobbying to get bigger. If you can’t answer this maybe the reason is race… I hope not.
Uncle Matt
November 17th, 2008 4:36 pm

PS 199 parents don’t want to go to PS191 because it is an inferior school. Most PS199 parents have made very important life decisions, i.e. whether to stay in the city and where to live, cecntered around their access to PS199. That they would be asked to move simply because they do not want to is absurd.
And I should point out that 85 or so comments into this blog, still not one Center School parent can present an valid or cogent argument as to why they should not have to move. So in the 11th hour when things are not going their way, Center School decides to use scorched earth, shock and awe tactics screaming “Diversity”.
Fact: Center School was not founded to promote diversity district wide or at all, and indeed the word diversity doesn’t appear anywhere in their mission statement.
For you Center School folk, here is your mission statement:
“Learning is likely to be more effective if it grows out of what interests the learner.” This sign hangs in a prominent position in a jumbled office that bustles with activity and serves as the heart of the school. All indicators point to the main philosophy of the school—that we want all students to feel that they are in control of their education. The Center School starts with the needs of children and is constantly focused on the means to meet these needs. We provide a rich academic life with good literature to read, opportunity to think and express your thoughts, and a myriad of ways to express yourself through art, drama, and writing. Recognizing the special needs of the adolescent and their struggle with puberty and emotions, the staff tries to help them develop a sense of their own value system.
I rest my case.
This is a recording
November 17th, 2008 4:38 pm

This has been answered several times - please read above and stop trying to bait people by throwing charged terms that are, frankly, insulting to those that have actually experienced racism in their lives.
Uncle Matt
November 17th, 2008 4:39 pm

Amen. See you Wednesday.
I love ps199
November 17th, 2008 4:40 pm

in response to “diversity lies”IF This is not about RACE? then why don’t 199 parents want to go to 191? Because it is sooooo far away? Please.

—I don’t want to go to 191 because i live across the street from 199. Lets be honest here - 199 is a better school RIGHT NOW. maybe it won’t be in a few years >>but RIGHT NOW when my kid will be in school it is not as good. So what is it about that that you or anyone who reads these posts don’t understand? This is my childs future and I will not jeopardize it to be politically correct. I have gotten the point where I don’t even care if you call me a racist. Rightnow this is the makeup of the catchment. If it is too white for you I am sorry but it is what it is. I worked hard to make the money to buy my apartment and live there and I am sick and tired of apologizing for it. So call me a racist..it won’t change a thing.
Academic
November 17th, 2008 4:45 pm

QUESTION: IF This is not about race then why don’t 199 parents want to go to 191? Because it is sooooo far away? ANSWER: Because PS 199 received an “A” from the DOE, while PS 191 received a “C”. Enough said.
flummoxed
November 17th, 2008 4:46 pm

Does someone want to explain to me why Cynthia Nixon sends her kid to the LEAST diverse middle school in District 3 if she is so concerned about diversity?
more diversity lies
November 17th, 2008 5:00 pm

Center School is the least diverse middle school in District 3. So,why are they suddenly climbing all over the diversity issue?
Horace B
November 17th, 2008 5:32 pm

I love ps199

thank you for being honest, unlike uncle matt.
Future 199 Parent
November 17th, 2008 5:34 pm

Again, many of us would be fine with combining 199 and 191, as long as the two were entirely combined, and the new folks weren’t just shunted off to 191 without any of the resources of 191. Unfortunately, that wasn’t on of the options the DOE provided for the CEC to vote on. And I daresay the current 199 parents who are bemoaning an increase in the size of the school wouldn’t be doing so if the alterative were for THEIR kids to attend 191.
disgusted
November 17th, 2008 7:11 pm

Hopefully rezoning will put an underused 191 to good use, and then some of these parents will actually have a shorter walk with their kids. If they use even half the energy to boost up 191 as they have used to force out CS, it will be another good public school for NY’s children.
PS 199 parent too
November 17th, 2008 7:34 pm

While it wasn’t an option offered by the DOE/CEC officially - many 199 parents urged our politicians and DOE/CEC officials to consider combining 199 and 191’s populations, and split the grades - lower at 199, upper at 191 to benefit both schools. We asked John White to work on the option he mentioned at one of the most recent meetings to start up a new school at the PS 9 building (rumor had it that it would be run by PS 87’s current principal) that would handle overflow from the entire catchement. The charges that the DOE/CEC are offering one solution for one school is based on the fact that moving Center School disrupts a thriving school FOR A ONE YEAR FIX FOR 199 only. Then we have an overcrowding issue again. And no cluster rooms again. The high rises that are now under construction will soon be filled up with new young families, and our school will be truly over-crowded. You can try to argue that 199 is diverse - but that’s past history. The kindergarten class this year is 4% african american (that’s less than 1 child in each of the 7 classes). The school will have to accept all incoming admissions next year - so whether those buildings are completed by Sept or May - there will be an influx of new kids beyond the incoming kindergarteners. This was a rare opportunity to relieve the problem. And it will be gone. All of it will only get amplified from here - more new families, no funds for new school buildings (read the news lately???) no diversity (something that was once prized if you were a west sider). We should all be fighting this fight together - ask the PAC committee this issue. Middle schools admissions are difficult - whether based on test, or based on an interview -there are few slots, and more and more kids. Think beyond your current walk across the street - and you may realize that this is all of our problem.
disgusted
November 17th, 2008 8:02 pm

agreed
Future 199 Parent
November 17th, 2008 8:17 pm

PS 199 parent too:

Did you get a sense for why DOE/CEC wouldn’t consider combining the zones? It really is the best alternative. Then again, there’s no reason it can’t happen next year, or the year after. Why do you think the possibility has disappeared?
199 parent
November 17th, 2008 9:09 pm

I have noticed that all of this diversity talk is talk. If you care so much about diversity, like the parents applying to Center this year, why didn’t you go to a more diverse school-I am sure there is room in several of them, like 191, and open up some spots for more diversity at 199. No, you didn’t offer that as an option. You wanted k thru 2 at 191, so your kids weren’t affected. So face it, you are just trying to get into center school. Why don’t you just be honest. You’d get a lot more respect that way.
Horace B
November 17th, 2008 9:17 pm

199 parent

got you last
enough is enough
November 17th, 2008 9:22 pm

Combining these 2 zones wouldn’t actually work; there still isn’t enough room. If you truly want a diverse school, unzone the entire district. But most parents wouldn’t want that. For whatever it’s worth, there are plenty of schools that are less diverse than 199- ps290, 41, 6, 234 to name a few. And I don’t hear anyone running around calling them racists.
Future 199 Parent
November 17th, 2008 9:31 pm

>If you care so much about diversity, like the parents applying to Center this year, why didn’t you go to a more diverse school-I am sure there is room in several of them, like 191, and open up some spots for more diversity at 199. No, you didn’t offer that as an option. You wanted k thru 2 at 191, so your kids weren’t affected.

??? Was this to me? I don’t want to send my kid to 191 because it’s a bad school. My hope would be that if the 2 schools were combined, that would change. And really, it doesn’t matter which school the kids started out at. K-2 at 191 and 3-5 at 199 would be fine, if the Administration and PTA of 199 were involved at both levels.
Uncle Matt
November 17th, 2008 9:33 pm

Hey Horace B and all you diversity-baiting fools, I only write the truth, you know it, and you still haven’t offered one good reason why Center School should not move to a more ample facility with less crowding.
Oh, wait, I think I remember something about Elaine saying it would be “Disruptive”. Funny, my wafe says it is “disruptive” when I leave the toilet seat up, but somehow dispite this disruption our marriage flourishes.
Anyway, you guys have no intelligent answers to the real question so I’ll leave this where I left it last time I posted. See you Wednesday.
ohmygod
November 17th, 2008 9:34 pm

We all understand why pre-k parents want to send their kids to 199 next year. BUT Please someone answer the question - WHY do we want 200 - 250 more kids in a school that already has lines on the swings? No school play. When will lunch be? Can someone answer the question, when every school in the nation wants to get SMALLER we are lobbying to get bigger. If you can’t answer this maybe the reason is race… I hope not.
Center School parent
November 17th, 2008 9:36 pm

I really don’t want to move. It would be very inconvenient.
OMFGG
November 17th, 2008 9:36 pm

Are you going to keep repeating the same post - VERBATIM - but under a different name each time, ohmygod? Come on, get more creative.
199
November 17th, 2008 9:42 pm

No one wants a bigger school. Unfortunately there are children entitled to go to the school and we need space for them. That’s the bottom line.
areUkidding?
November 17th, 2008 9:46 pm

1 valid reason for Center School not moving? Are you kidding? If it was your middle school kid who was being forcibly moved - You would be insulting - smearing everyone in sight. What if the transition affects their High School test? Unfortunately in this competitive environment for HS anything can be the difference between going to the school that is best for them. What if teachers drop? Absentiism goes up. Applications go down. The idiotic school grade goes down? Has the DOE done ANY due diligence on what happens when you forcibly move a middle school? Answer: NO. Does any educator think that it is a good idea to uproot a middle school? Why is there a Middle school task force? Why is there a Middle School Crisis? In three years these parents will be complaining about the lack of good middle schools.
short sighted sour grapes.
Response to areUkidding
November 17th, 2008 9:54 pm

So why isn’t the Anderson school complaining about their move? Are CS students less equipped to handle it?
to ohmygod and disgusted
November 17th, 2008 9:56 pm

to Ohmygod: Nobody wants a bigger school, but we’ve got it whether we like it or not. That’s the bottom line.

to Disgusted: You always spell catchment wrong.
Uncle Matt
November 17th, 2008 10:12 pm

“1 valid reason for Center School not moving? Are you kidding? If it was your middle school kid who was being forcibly moved - You would be insulting - smearing everyone in sight. What if the transition affects their High School test?”

As if the kids are going to be packing and hauling boxes and furtniture instead of studying?! Wow that is a creative answer! C’mon folks! The move will take place over the summer. Kids will arrive at a nice new facility and have plenty of time to study in their school year. How about a valid answer to the question now?

Until then, see you Wednesday.
response to rukidding
November 17th, 2008 10:15 pm

Holy cow, you are out of it. Schools move all the time. Remember when computer moved? Remember when Stuyvesant moved. Actually, I see no evidence that moving will have a negative impact. maybe it will be for the best. You seem hypersensitive. I hope your kid is more resilient than you are.
areUkidding?
November 17th, 2008 10:24 pm

- any time you want to discuss with computer about how their move went - go ahead. Why do you think they are so pissed Anderson is coming. It was a miserable transition. Get your head out of the sand. Stuy is a HS. And was not forcibly moved - they were put into a shiny new building built for them. The startling fact is the DOE has no example of a middle school that they have moved successfully. You see no evidence because you are not looking. You are worried about your precious little prince who you take 20 blocks away to nursery school having to walk 10 blocks to Kindergarten - I hope your kid is more resilient than you are. Or maybe more empathetic to others.
response to rukidding
November 17th, 2008 10:28 pm

So is Center school waiting for a shiny new building? Then they will want to move? Then the move will be successful? Oh, thanks. I get it now.
Horace B
November 17th, 2008 10:38 pm

Uncle Matt, congratulations on maning up and putting the missus in her place by peeing like a man. You got me there. Oh yeah, I am the diversity you speak of. See you on Wed.
YOUR NEIGHBOR
November 17th, 2008 11:15 pm

To me, the most disturbing part of this entire discussion has been the blanket statements made on this topic. All future PS 199 parents and current PS 199 parents are racists, and all center school parents are crazy and part of a cult. The Center School has been in operation for 26 years, not everyone whose child attended the school is nuts. As to the “PS 199 group”, lets face it the City doesnt do much to diversify schools. Is that the fault of the PS 199 group no, but its the truth. With that said, the rest of my comments are directed to the small but highly organized current group of Center School parents (many of whom attended PS 199 at some point) who seem to be causing this entire mess. You have brought shame on our community with these charges of racism. Even if I give you the benefit of the doubt that you believe that some parents want the Center School to move because of race (I dont think anyone actually falls into this category) there is no way you believe that the entire PS 199 Group is motivated by racism. Yet you have not peppered any of your statements on the race issue with phrases like “some of,” or even “many of them” and for this I hold you completely responsible for this situation and wonder how you sleep at night. You called all of your neighbors racist. Again I direct these comments to the small group of center parents orchestrating this smoke and mirror show. Also I wish someone would represent PS 191. All these high powered parents for 199 and Center School and no voice for PS 191. Thats the saddest part of the whole thing. We should have come together to deal with that …not had a huge fight over two schools with lots of privileged kids on both sides.
Uncle Pat
November 17th, 2008 11:42 pm

Personally, I believe this issue has almost nothing to do with Elaine being stubborn or not wanting to waste her summer moving or any of this garbage 199 supporters are throwing at The Center School, namely the complete joke of “Uncle Matt.” Simply, its the close-mindedness of the people that want Center School to move that is making this ugly conflict. Simply put, looking at other options, the option to fix this problem by moving Center School seems naive. Why can we not just simply kill three birds with one stone and JOIN 191 and 199. This way, you could put grades K-2 in 191 and 3-5 in 199, and have plenty of space for both. Also, you could mix up teachers and other staff, having a principal for each building, etc. Not only would this fix space issues, but it would also fix diversity and under-performing issues that everybody seems to complain about. Unless 199 and 191 have some problem with each other, I see no reason why this couldn’t be done. Then Center School would continue their happy strides where they are. Now, looking at this option, why would we want to move Center School. 199 would have to think of a way to fix their space problems anyway whether or not CS moves, and then by the time they find a way to fix it, the space moving CS gives them will end up being just extra room.

Why should Center School have to move because of the close-mindedness of these 199 supporters?
YOUR NEIGHBOR
November 17th, 2008 11:50 pm

Uncle Pat: I give up. You used my comments to justify the Center School staying. You dont care about diversity. At this point, Center School must move because the damage to the community cannot be undone without a separation of these two schools. As to the combination of these grades, thats not the solution I had in mind. I meant mixing zone lines going forward. I wont be back for anymore discussions on this blog.
David
November 18th, 2008 12:29 am

I am currently a high school student at an independent school in New York. I have never been enrolled in a public school, so I can’t pretend to understand firsthand the problems of overcrowding in the city schools. However, I am disgusted by the way that the two sides of this issue have been attacking each other through their comments on a blog that can be read anywhere in the world. Important issues like school overcrowding can only be solved through calm and rational discourse, not personal and angry attacks. Both sides are arguing that the other side is advancing an agenda of self interest, but I think that both sides are just trying to do what they think is best for their children. While I don’t know all of the details of this debate, there must be some sort of compromise that could be reached that would help out the students of both schools. The divisiveness of the comments to this blog post are more characteristic of a political campaign than a squabble over a school.
The Final Chapter
November 18th, 2008 9:35 am

Resolution:
1. The Center School moves to a great new space. The kids love it. They find new places to hang out and eat on the upper west side.

2. Elaine Schwartz resigns. She receives a great package and her reputation as an educator is once again discovered and admired. She spends her summers in the Hamptons and gets lots of visits from former students and parents who also have homes in the Hamptons.

3. The five students from PS 199 who get automatic admission to the Center School do not get in. They go to other fabulous selective middle schools the old fashion way…on merit.

4. A new principal is named of the Center School. He or she and a committee administer the admission practices for the school. Who you know makes no difference in getting in. Being on the PTA doesnt help either.

5. All the parents that participated in this debate realize that they would like to make a difference in the community. They stay active, go to meetings and look for ways to better City schools on ALL levels. Not just their own school. What about education can we learn from PS 199 and Center School and apply those lessons to other schools?

6. The City makes zone lines without the interest of developers and the wealthy in mind.

7. The Center School has a big party to show its new facilities to the community. Everyone meets great nice families and kids that go there.

8. The few Center School parents/ PS 199 parents that caused this mess move to the Suburbs. No one visits them.

9. The rest of us see each other around the neighborhood and joke about how great it is that Bush isnt President anymore.

10. The End.
Jennifer
November 18th, 2008 9:59 am

So Center School’s SOLE reason for not wanting to move is that it will be “disruptive.” Their kids might suffer a month or two of “disruption.” And in order to avoid that, they are causing an enormous race issue, dividing the UWS school community, and trying to create an overcrowding situation for hundreds of kids for years to come? You people are so incredibly spoiled, selfish, and self-entitled. GET OVER IT. Yes, your kids would have a few months of disruption, but it’s for years and years of the greater good of the district. Seriously, get over yourselves!
Julie
November 18th, 2008 10:02 am

All this brouhaha and hate-baiting because a move will be TEMPORARILY INCONVENIENT? Are you people SERIOUS? I’m floored…utterly floored. I thought there were some serious logistical issues at hand, but it’s just because it might DISRUPT the students for a couple weeks? Good God.
I need a good laugh today
November 18th, 2008 10:09 am

Dear Final Chapter. Very funny email. I like your style. Can we be friends/spouses?
Future 199 Parent
November 18th, 2008 10:09 am

Bravo Final Chapter. Sounds perfect.
Disruption
November 18th, 2008 10:12 am

It won’t even disrupt the kids. It’s not like they’ll be moving boxes. And they won’t do it during school time either. They’ll arrive in the fall to a brand-new building.
Uncle Matt
November 18th, 2008 10:43 am

Final Chapter, you are hands down my fave. Thanks for keeping it real. Peace and love.
The Final Chapter Fan Club
November 18th, 2008 10:49 am

To Final Chapter: You, I like.
Final Chapter Groupie
November 18th, 2008 10:58 am

omg 2kool4skool xoxo !
Deborah L
November 18th, 2008 11:11 am

I am a PS 199 parent in favor of the proposal that moves the Center School. I think we as parents have a responsibility, whatever our positiion is first and foremost, to be an example to our children as to how to resolve differences and to work and live amongst people’s whose ideals and goals differ from our own. Name calling, involving children, injecting race into arguments are all deplorable tactics. There is enough bad behavior on all sides to give everyone pause and embarrassment. What has been said and done cannot be taken back - but we can stop now and go forward with an eye towards re-building our community. In this fight, not all interested parties will be happy or satisfied. Winning without dignity and losing without grace aren’t ideals I want to teach my child. Let’s focus on educating our children on how to be decent people. Re-read the email chain, and think hard . . . whatever side you are on . . . are these the parents whose homes you want your children to grow up visiting and being influenced by. The overcrowding issue must be addressed, this is a fact. The resolution will be disappointing for some. There will be a resolution and we will all have to live with it. I know people feel passionate when things involve their children, but I ask that the parents of PS 199 and those of The Center School understand take a
Deborah L
November 18th, 2008 11:13 am

that education is more than test scores, building, books and schools. We may not find common ground on this issue, but I believe our hearts are in the same place when it comees to our kids. Let’s focus on healing.
Marta H
November 18th, 2008 1:20 pm

I am a Center School parent in favor of the proposal that does not move the Center School. I think we as parents have a responsibility, whatever our positiion is first and foremost, to be an example to our children as to how to resolve differences and to work and live amongst people’s whose ideals and goals differ from our own. Name calling, involving children, injecting race into arguments are all deplorable tactics. There is enough bad behavior on all sides to give everyone pause and embarrassment. What has been said and done cannot be taken back - but we can stop now and go forward with an eye towards re-building our community. In this fight, not all interested parties will be happy or satisfied. Winning without dignity and losing without grace aren’t ideals I want to teach my child. Let’s focus on educating our children on how to be decent people. Re-read the email chain, and think hard . . . whatever side you are on . . . are these the parents whose homes you want your children to grow up visiting and being influenced by. The overcrowding issue must be addressed, this is a fact. The resolution will be disappointing for some. There will be a resolution and we will all have to live with it. I know people feel passionate when things involve their children, but I ask that the parents of PS 199 and those of The Center School understand take a
Marta H
November 18th, 2008 1:21 pm

that education is more than test scores, building, books and schools. We may not find common ground on this issue, but I believe our hearts are in the same place when it comees to our kids. Let’s focus on healing.
saddened parent
November 18th, 2008 2:28 pm

Unfortunately the damage is done. Everyone involved knows that this is not about race. Some people have been able to take this lightly because they see it as a ploy. Others, including myself, find this unforgivable. So, I don’t know how the community can heal. At this point, there is no turning back and the Center School must leave. Things have just gotten too ugly. It didn’t have to go in this direction. And they can have their friend Cynthia cut it out. Afterall, she moved into the ps75 catchment so she could be zoned for their school. Enough is enough!
ben franklin
November 18th, 2008 3:13 pm

TO ELAINE AND HER PAL CYNTHIA NIXON So long, farewell, auf wiedersehen, goodbye
I leave and heave a sigh and say goodbye — Goodbye!
I’m glad to go, I cannot tell a lie
I flit, I float, I fleetly flee, I fly
The sun has gone to bed and so must I
So long, farewell, auf Wiedersehen, goodbye
Goodbye!

Goodbyes are not forever.
Goodbyes are not the end.
They simply mean I’ll miss you
Until we meet again!

Excuse me, then! you know my heart;
But dearest friends, alas! must part.

Happy trails to you, until we meet again.
Some trails are happy ones,
Others are blue.
It’s the way you ride the trail that counts,
Here’s to a happy one for you.
ben franklin
November 18th, 2008 3:19 pm

Nothing makes the earth seem so spacious as to have friends at a distance; they make the latitudes and longitudes. ~Henry David Thoreau
ben franklin
November 18th, 2008 3:23 pm

May you have warm words on a cool evening, a full moon on a dark night, and a smooth road all the way OUT THE DOOR
ben franklin
November 18th, 2008 3:34 pm

A goodbye isn’t painful unless we are going to say hello again.
Horace B
November 18th, 2008 3:59 pm

So ugly. Schadenfreude ist die beste Freude.
maryann
November 18th, 2008 4:48 pm

Dear PS 199 parents - yes, we do have the best intentions for our kids. You should know this: the two new buildings you see going up right now (Bdwy & 72nd - 23 stories, and Amsterdam & 69th - 48 stories) will be occupied by early 2010. So they are coming. Luckily, we’ll have space to devote to them. Our once small & diverse school will now be very big and very homogeneous. Sounds like the suburbs to me. Mission accomplished.
disgusted
November 18th, 2008 7:21 pm

I read a lot parents saying they don’t want their 5 year old kids to have to go a few more blocks to school, yet they don’t seem to mind hauling their pre-schoolers all over the city to go to the “best” nursery schools hoping to get into the “right” G and T program.

As for CS being reluctant to move; has anyone been let down by dealing with the BOE? Was maybe something promised to you that didn’t work out? Yet, you seem shocked that Ms. Schwartz (after dealing with them for 26 years) would be a little nervous by promises of a great new space.

If you believe the “End of Days” talk of the 199 parents, then this is only a temporary fix anyway. Well I guess they are hoping to buy enough time for their kids to finish without having them be moved to a “bigger, nicer space only a few blocks north (or south).”
Scared of the likes of Uncle Matt
November 18th, 2008 7:31 pm

I’ve been reading the blogs for two days trying to refrain from writing anything. Well I lost that battle with myself. There are so many things I would like to respond to but there isn’t nearly enough time. First to the parent who was considering The Center School but because Elaine hand picks her students The Center School didn’t answer the phone. Yeah, that’s it, they looked at the caller ID and said ooh ooh don’t answer it’s an interested parent and we hand pick our students. To the idiots who think something is wrong with her grand kids attending the school she founded. You would be complaining if she didn’t …”Can you believe she didn’t even take her grand kids.” In addition your obsession with the fact the Cynthia Nixon’s profession happens to be actor is irrelevant she is a PARENT first fighting the fight for her kids.
In addition you ill informed bloggers all middle schools are not zoned and you apply to them all. Another thing
I don’t see how ones job, relationship to aother person, or where they own a home has any relevance. The fact of the matter is The Center School is a good school, and has been in it ’s home for 26 years. Elaine Shwartz has made the Center School along with it’s administrators, and teachers the great school that it is. Her reward for all of her hard work is to literally be put out to serve the needs of the most self centered group of individuals around. If your child were in a middle school that was about to be evicted from it’s home you’d be in the trenches fighting as most parents would.
The mud slinging because you don’t agree is in poor taste. As for the racism I’m not sure how deep it runs, but it is there alive and well. And of course it is not everyone but you know who you are you are the most defensive, the most outspoken and most of all most cowardly.
Anyone can see that this is not about SPACE. There is so much more going on here. You know it, the CEC knows it and all those staying silent know it. My only hope is that the entire world knows what the so called progressive UWS is up to. And when this fight between schools end’s I will make it my one person mission to make many aware of the injustice that was done in 2008 on the UWS.
Uncle Matt
November 18th, 2008 7:34 pm

“I read a lot parents saying they don’t want their 5 year old kids to have to go a few more blocks to school, yet they don’t seem to mind hauling their pre-schoolers all over the city to go to the “best” nursery schools hoping to get into the “right” G and T program.”

More diversionary nonsense from the Center School. Ignore it.

Hey Einsteins, unfortunately there are no catchment nursurey schools. Or didn’t you get that memo?

So the parents who do chose to send their kids to nursery school for early socialization do the best they can and do in fact try to find the closest ones possible. The long journeys are somewhat tempered by the fact that nursery school is not every day.

We applied to the one closest to us and it was our first choice exactly because of location. Didn’t get in so we went the closest one that accepted us.

Once again I find myself up here trying to have a battle of wits with unarmed people (i.e. Center School folk).

See you tomorrow.
disgusted
November 18th, 2008 8:02 pm

Actually though not catchment pre-k’s, there are a lot of public pre-’s and according to the Board of Ed there were still some spots open in the city pre-k’s as of last month. I also know that there are a lot of nursery schools between 199 and Hollingsworth, yet several 199 families make that journey EVERYDAY.

PS I’m not a Center School parent.

Please wear your name tag tomorrow.
To scared of the likes of Uncle Matt
November 18th, 2008 8:07 pm

Dear scared, my kid’s middle school is about to be relocated. a few blocks south. Yes, its Anderson. it will not be relocated to a building with an elementary school, but to one with 2 middle schools, one with many reports of violence. Am I concerned? Yes, a little.
But mostly I TRUST MY ADMINISTRATION and know that they will work with the DOE and the current and new schools/neighbors to make the transition as smooth as possible. The kids will need to get used to new WALLS and FLOORS and a new address. Well, they are certainly old enough to manage that skill, and I TRUST that their school is good enough to have taught them those skills…
SO, NO, I am NOT fighting, NOT in the trenches, nor are ANY of the 500 or so families at Anderson.
So please speak for yourself.

And we don’t have the track record of an administration that has been there for 20+ years. We have a relatively new (and spectacular) principal. But we TRUST that the parent body, the teachers and the administration are GOOD ENOUGH and strong enough so that this, although inconvenient, will not have any long term impact. Not a negative one, anyway.
If we had such an amazing administration that has been there for 26 years, such a great teacher body and parents as YOU describe them, we would even have less of a reason to doubt the move.

I am sorry. I know it’s not easy to move. It must be difficult for Elaine who has created the school, to make a change. But to go from “not easy” to the reactions we have all seen lately, is really and totally beyond my grasp, or that of any Anderson parent I know.
Oh, and by the way, at Anderson we are not only talking about 12 year olds who will move, but also 6-7 year olds. Much more complex.
Uncle Matt
November 18th, 2008 8:10 pm

“Please wear your name tag tomorrow.”

You too, “disgusted”. If only I did not have to worry about my wife being accosted by center school folks in front of our kids as has been happening at the PS199 drop off every day. True story, I wish it was not.

As to your commentary, perhaps those PS199 parents traveling the long journey found themselves in the same position as we did– couldn’t get in to a closer school. Sadly there are too few spots for too many kids in nursery school.
disgusted
November 18th, 2008 8:18 pm

It wasn’t a commentary or judgement. Just pointing out that parents don’t seem to mind traveling as much as they say.
D
November 18th, 2008 8:23 pm

Dear disgusted - bet you are a Computer School parent. Or possibly 199 parent who is coveting a Center School spot.

in any case, you talk about CHOICE. some parents who CHOOSE to send their kids to a farther away pre-k (by the way, no pre-k at ps199. guess why? yep, space).
like parents who CHOOSE to send their kids to MSC or a private school. but choice is a result of options. and the option to send elementary school kids to their zoned school is what this is all about.
go to insideschools.org to the blogs and read about the DOE’s criteria for accepting kids into public elementary schools. the values of:
1. keeping siblings together
2. zoned kids deserve the option to attend their school
are the 2 top values.
no word about middle school kids not having to move buildings.
disgusted
November 18th, 2008 8:40 pm

1. keeping siblings together
2. zoned kids deserve the option to attend their school
are the 2 top values.

True D, all they more reason to rezone 191 and 199, and require new large buildings to provide schools.
disgusted
November 18th, 2008 8:42 pm

D

By the way, after you fix 199, are you going to speak up for the schools that are actually at or above the class cap and giving classes in trailers?
Uncle Matt
November 18th, 2008 8:46 pm

“Scared of the likes of Uncle Matt”, Anderson School’s handling of the situation is something that should be lauded by all parties on all side of this argument. You not only do you have my utmost respect, but my gratitue, in all ernest. None of this is ideal. In fact it is a real mess. We should have more schools and more space in each school. But sadly, this city continues in its longstanding and not so noble tradition of incompetence.

It was only 33 years ago that Gerald Ford told NYC to drop dead and allowed this place to go bankrupt. At the core of the problem was exactly what we are facing now– poor planning and utter mismanagement. And for this, your grace is all the more to be admired.

That said, there is no reason to fear the likes of me. My purpose here on this blog is to call BS and point out the real issues. And Center School has been executing a very centralized and organized effort to obfuscate the real issue and create a new one in the name of diversity, a word that does not even appear once in the Center School mission statement (i.e. spread BS like wildfire).

Everything I have written here is fact, for example Elaine Schwartz grandkids attended the school, her most vocal PTA member is her son in law Alan Madison, and the fact that mom’s at PS199 are being verbally abused in fron of their kids by Center School parents every day. I WISH I was making this stuff up.

My tenacity in broadcasting these sad and unfortunate truths is motivated by my contempt for curruption and abuse of power, and based on your description of the Center School administration, I think you can understand why I feel Center Schools is guilty of those things.

Again, I have stated facts, and you will notice that no one from the Center School has disputed them. They have simply done what they have been doing all along– changing the subject and bringing up diversionary issues that are not germane to the issue at hand which is now, has always been, and will always be, overcrowding.

Respectfully, Uncle Matt
Uncle Matt
November 18th, 2008 8:51 pm

“By the way, after you fix 199, are you going to speak up for the schools that are actually at or above the class cap and giving classes in trailers?”

I certainly plan to. This whole situation is upsetting, and something I had no idea about until recently. It has been invigorating to be involved in community.

As I said, we need more schools and more space in existing ones.
disgusted
November 18th, 2008 9:00 pm

Some how having her grandkids at her school and having a son-in-law being a vocal fan of the school equals widespread corruption? And that has to do with overcrowding how?

The issue at hand, overcrowding. How many classes in 199 are at or above the cap for NYC? Is 199 entitled to relief before all the other schools in the city?
Uncle Matt
November 18th, 2008 9:29 pm

“Some how having her grandkids at her school and having a son-in-law being a vocal fan of the school equals widespread corruption?”

Hey disgusted, why don’t you do yourself a favor and read top to bottom cause I cited plenty more that qualifies. And again, why don’t you first answer 1) Why Alan has never once mentioned his relationship to Elaine and 2) why Caleb was one of the Center School alum who stood up to speak last week at JOA and why he did not identify himself?

Tell you what. If it is so above board to assign coveted public middle school seats to your grandkids and their friends on something other than a blind admissions basis, why don’t we just ask the DOE to conduct an admission audit?
Uncle Matt
November 18th, 2008 9:31 pm

If the DOE supports your conclusion that Elaine’s grandkids are entitled to atend Middle school simply for being Elaine’s grandkids, then case closed. Whaddaya say? I can call them and request the audit.
Former PS 199 Parent
November 18th, 2008 9:37 pm

Diversity at Center School? What a joke! It was my experience as a former parent at 199, and watching the process for 6 years, that the vast majority of kids that ever got into that school had some connection to a connection — whether it was a friend of Elaine Schwartz or the PTA president or one of the friends of the PTA president. Or some other connection to the in-crowd. Its a disgrace that they are trying to play the race card. The neighborhood school is for the kids in the neighborhood, not some middle school that pretends to be something that it is not. Center School needs to go. Their lease is up.
note to Uncle Matt
November 18th, 2008 10:13 pm

Hey Uncle Matt,

You request the audit and I will give you the list of 199 kids that are going to get accepted, in order of preference, based on their connections and who they know.
Back From Dinner
November 18th, 2008 10:21 pm

Well hello to all: I had checked in at some point today and had high hopes that we had progressed beyond some of the anger. “Wear your name tags tomorrow.” Thats funny. I am actually curious as to the identities of some of the parties on this blog. To saddened: I know how you feel, but lets face it we have made a public spectacle of ourselves and as parents of young children, we need to move forward. Period no buts. You cant hold a grudge forever. To the PS 199 parents, look at it from the Center School parents’ point of view, they started a school at a time when no one went to public school and now the wealthy are clamoring for a space at the table they set. To the Center School parents, life isnt fair and PS 199 school needs the space, and no one wants you out because your school is diverse so lets stop calling the PS 199 parents who want you out racist. Elaine Schwartz has to go because (i) she has stated that she has considered retirement at this point in her life, (ii) she has made some very public statements that were inappropriate and need to be forgotten; and (iii) whether the rumors are true or not the public perception of her school is being tarnished by admitting the children of friends and relatives (who may or may not have been qualified to attend the school). Center School must go because well, frankly, because there is no turning back at this point. Does anyone believe that the two schools can share space going forward???!!!! As to Cynthia Nixon, dont freak out now, but she may have actually believed what she was saying. Hopefully by now she realizes she made a mistake. Yes PS 199 is overcrowded, and yes a smaller diverse school is better but the City is out of money, and the buildings went up, so lets move forward and see if we can find some new space, attempt to rezone for diversity and find cash for new schools in this fiscal crisis. To the small group of Center School parents keeping this thing alive and growing, let it go already.
Uncle Matt
November 18th, 2008 10:31 pm

“Hey Uncle Matt,

You request the audit and I will give you the list of 199 kids that are going to get accepted, in order of preference, based on their connections and who they know.”

Tell you what. I’ll set up an email account where you can send those names and post back here shortly. No one gets a pass when it pertains to corruption in the adminissions process. I don’t care what school they come from. Center School is a public school. Nepotism and chronyism have no place in a public school. I will get back to you shortly with that email.
Uncle Matt
November 18th, 2008 10:37 pm

OK. You can send me the names to unclematthew@live.com

Thanks much.
note to Uncle Matt
November 18th, 2008 10:52 pm

Uncle Matt,

I am not that computer savvy and I don’t want to send them from my email address. The DOE will get the list. Maybe I can try tomorrow to set up a new email account.
Uncle Matt
November 18th, 2008 11:01 pm

OK. Whenever oyu are ready. My account is all set up and awaiting your information.
disgusted
November 19th, 2008 7:16 am

So much for the issues.

Make your case. How many classes are at or above current DOE cap levels? Why is PS 199 entitled to relief for other schools?
disgusted
November 19th, 2008 7:42 am

Sorry typo.
Why is 199 entitled to relief BEFORE other schools?
ben franklin
November 19th, 2008 8:40 am

I’ll be wearing a uncle matt name tab TONIGHT
Boing
November 19th, 2008 9:12 am

See you tonight, Uncle Matt, you rabble rouser you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07xqTHSrzOc

BTW, who needs a name tag - buy this hoodie instead.

http://images0.cafepress.com/product/122112930v2_350×350_Front.jpg
Good responses, finally
November 19th, 2008 10:02 am

Bravo, “Back From Dinner” - you said everything perfectly. I hope you’ll be there tonight.
disgusted
November 19th, 2008 11:30 am

Strange on the main issue of overcrowding, no answer. I would think you would have these numbers memorized to make your case.

How many PS 199 classes are at or above DOE cap?

You will get no argument from me that these cap numbers are to high, especially since many schools operate above these caps. You can also join in the fight with a lot of other parents that have been making that case for years, well after their children have left school.
bereal
November 19th, 2008 12:33 pm

Uncle Matt - when professional courtesy is extended, those on the sidelines generally step aside without whining. Which is why MANY MANY MANY children and grandchildren of PS 199 faculty & administrators as well as Center School’s have been allowed into 199 and/or Center School. Life in the big city may be too tough for you…grow up.
disgusted
November 19th, 2008 1:37 pm

PS 199 parents, make yourself heard.
How many kids in your child’s class, what grade level?
Is your child’s class overcrowded? By what standard?
Who has a kid in a class that is at or above DOE cap?
If you don’t know the answer, find out.
D
November 19th, 2008 2:12 pm

Uncle matt and note to Uncle Matt - would love to get that list too.
d3parent@gmail.com

See you tonight!
Uncle Matt
November 19th, 2008 3:16 pm

“Uncle Matt - when professional courtesy is extended, those on the sidelines generally step aside without whining. Which is why MANY MANY MANY children and grandchildren of PS 199 faculty & administrators as well as Center School’s have been allowed into 199 and/or Center School. Life in the big city may be too tough for you…grow up.”
Wow, I needed a good laugh. Thanks for that.

You can call it a “professional courtesy” or whatever you would like, but I am pretty sure that such egregious admissions practices would raise the ire of the DOE, ESPECIALLY if they are as common as you just acknoledged them to be.

Still waiting for the list. unclematthew(at)live.com
D
November 19th, 2008 3:28 pm

Uncle matt - you are right! I am amazed at how Elaine has been able to keep everyone out of her process for so many years. If the one thing that comes out of this, except for the space issue, is more transparecy in the SC admissions process - it will be HUGE.
Having her grandchildren, PTA president’s kids, friends and family is just corrupt. Especially since it’s you and me who are paying for this.
Quite incredible if you think about it.
disgusted
November 19th, 2008 4:14 pm

Once again, everyone seems to know all about Elaine Schwartz, but does anyone know what the class sizes are at 199?

How many classes are above DOE caps???????

What about the issues?
disgusted
November 19th, 2008 4:54 pm

C’mon, name just one class that is overcrowded, and by how many.

Kind of like WMD’s.
hypocrites
November 19th, 2008 4:59 pm

Clean our own house out first before you worry about CS’s. How did our PTA president get in? Ask her about walking 30 blocks to a good school. Why is she taking a spot of a catchment child? I’m sure we can all hold our breathe for that answer. Hypocrites and Sour grapes.
disgusted
November 19th, 2008 5:48 pm

Dear hypocrites, send Uncle Matt an email. He is collecting names for his audit.

Still waiting on some numbers.
Uncle Matt
November 19th, 2008 9:07 pm

Hey disgusted, the building will have fwer occupants in it net net when Center School is out. And praise the CEC, the resolution passed, so we will get relief. Add to that, Center school takes up a disproportionate amount of space per capita (smaller class sizes) and utilzes resources that PS199 kids only get to after Center School, so our class sizes will decrease, we will get an art room back, we can use our library, etc. Pretty simple.
Uncle Matt
November 19th, 2008 9:32 pm

Thank you CEC! The resolution passed this evening.

The evening was not without drama. To be blind and fair, public comments were taken by folks who put their names on index cards in a box from which the CEC drew blindly.

Alan Madison was up to his usual antics. The highlight was that he got called out by the CEC for stuffing the box with multiple index cards bearing his name. He replied “I’m just playing by the rules baby!”. So really he should not have had the opportunity to speak but I am glad he was as once again he flaunted his idiocy for all to see and hear with his only material comments being 1) a lie that a prospective PS199 parent was a paid lobbyist for PS199 and 2) he pointed to John White and called him a beaurecrat.

After Center School’s next speaker, Alan Madison (for those of you joining late, Alan in the Center School director’s son in law) and many if not most Center School parents stormed out of the auditorium. That was almost a precious as Alan being called out for stuffing the box, which is a sterling example of Center School ethics at work.

Good riddance Center School.
Scared of the likes of Uncle Matt
November 19th, 2008 9:58 pm

Wow Uncle Matt, the more I read the more I realize you have something very personal against Mr Madison. The son and law of the director of The Center School. It actually confuses me why you think his standing up for his mother and laws school is such a horrible thing. I only hope that if my mother were in the fight of her life trying to right a wrong, you know working for the DOE for 26 years creating one of the most highly recognized middle shools and basically being told by the DOE and the CEC Thank you and F you that my husband would get up stand in the trenches with her.
It says a great deal about who you are and your character that you find that so troubling. I hope that the mother of your wife never gets into any situation where she needs support!
note to Uncle Matt
November 19th, 2008 10:45 pm

you will get the list most likely over the weekend.
199er
November 19th, 2008 11:03 pm

“I’m not a celebrity and I’m not politically connected.” The parent with all the sperm turns out to be a lobbyist. What a laugh. Who writes speeches for politicians! Hypocrite. Well at least he is our hypocrite.
Uncle Matt
November 19th, 2008 11:07 pm

Nothing personal against Alan Madison. But his lack of decorum, vicious tactics, lies and devisiveness are deplorable. I focus on him because of his bad behavior and to highlight the incentuous and “closed” nature of the Center school and the irrational nature of their campaign not to leave.

This whole fight of theirs seems more about Elaine Schwartz and her lapdog son in law than the Center School kids, who will be getting a more ample and appropriate space in PS9.

Go figure.
Uncle Matt
November 19th, 2008 11:10 pm

And by the way, can one of you Center School people tell me how it is not personal and entirely inappropriate to accost and verbally abuse PS199 parents in front of their kids at the PS199 drop off. Again, this happens all the time.

Center School behavior is unacceptable.
Uncle Matt
November 19th, 2008 11:14 pm

“I’m not a celebrity and I’m not politically connected.” The parent with all the sperm turns out to be a lobbyist. What a laugh. Who writes speeches for politicians! Hypocrite. Well at least he is our hypocrite.”

A lobbyist in local New Jersey politics. What a leap you are making. Madison said he was paid by 199. Hardly true. He is just a prospective parent like so many in this argument.

Clearly Center School STILL has nothing legitimate to say.
wow
November 19th, 2008 11:18 pm

So the guy in the video above who said he had “no political connections” is really a lobbyist? What a creep.
truthinadvertising
November 19th, 2008 11:26 pm

http://www.wfsstrategies.com
The guy in the video is a lobbyist who works with Christine Quinn. I think she has something to do with education in NY politics. Clearly, ” I have no political connections” which is what he says in the video above… is what one might call a lie. He’s a lobbyist - that is what he does for a living. Is he the son in law of Elaine Schwartz as well? Look we won but let’s face it hiring a lobbyist is pretty sleazy.
Shame on you
November 19th, 2008 11:31 pm

Message to “Wow” — Shame on you for suggesting that the professional lives of the people who advocate on behalf of 199 in any way detracts from their mission as parents trying to get their children into our neighborhood school. Do you mean to say that there are no lawyers, actors, or other well-connected parents at the Center School? So what if there are? Each person is a parent first and foremost, and what we all do in our professional lives is irrelevant to the role that we’re playing here, in this debate — as parents. I am a lawyer and I have been involved in this controversy. Should my voice now be discounted?
disaster
November 19th, 2008 11:33 pm

what a disaster. 2 schools ruined. 800 kids in 199 and moving Center school. It is still beyond me why anyone would lobby for a bigger elementary school. Oh well I guess it is over except for the lawsuit. That should be entertaining.
Response to truthinadvertising
November 19th, 2008 11:34 pm

Settle down, everyone. No one hired a lobbyist. This is a parent, who has a young child and who lives in the school zone, and he showed up to the meetings speaking as a parent. I’m sure all of you have your careers as well; we’re just not fortunate enough to know the details of your lives. This is yet another diversion from the real issue.
wow
November 19th, 2008 11:37 pm

‘Shame on you’ - of course not - and u are being ridiculous - u didn’t get up and lie to make a point - and on video yet. HE said, “I have no political connections. A lie. Would you get up in front of a group of people and say - “I am not a lawyer?” When u were? You might not mention it but to lie - suggests hiding something. Watch the video. Did he lie? Easy answer. YES. THen the question becomes — why? You’re a lawyer - when someone lies what does that usually mean? They are hiding something. Speak your mind. Just don’t lie to people’s faces. DOn’t u think? Or maybe he forgot he had “political connections”
Cynthia Nixon's Ego
November 19th, 2008 11:38 pm

What am I, chopped liver? Am I not an advocate for public school education, a star of TV and Screen, who just maneuvered her way into a 20 (!) minute segment on NY1 with a second rate reporter licking my toes? C’mon people, I’m someone too. Even though I don’t live in the district, I’m someone to be reckoned with. Right? Is anyone listening to me? People? Hellooooo?
crooks & Liars
November 19th, 2008 11:42 pm

The guy is a parent? Did he tell you that? Does that carry the same weight as he doesn’t have “political connections”? The process is a sham. How about those poor people in the buildings that were zoned out. And just found out last week. That’s another lawsuit the city is going to have to pay for. I mean they are truly up the creek without a paddle.
Scared of the likes of Uncle Matt
November 19th, 2008 11:44 pm

I take offense to your accusation the the parents of PS 199 are being accosted and verbally abused at drop off. That is clearly a one sidied biased view. The same thing is happening on the other side. You can’t pretend this has been an “ATTACK”
The parents of PS 199 resorted to calling the children of PS 199 “Thugs” plasterd flyers of the Director all over the neighborhood and are basically rude to the parents of Center School who are just doing the same thing as they are fighting for what they think is right. As for The Center School having nothing legitimate to say. There is nothing legitimate being asked. I am never one to accuse an entire group of something but the motives of some of your parents were not pure. I will say this and then I have to disengage. Those who followed the white stockinged, decade old suit wearing leader who only had one motive are those I have a disagreement with. Those are the parents who had the motives not so pure. It’s just too bad that not everyone could see it.
I know The Center School will be able to function in any four walls. What keeps me blogging(and I am stopping) are the parents who did this for all the wrong reasons.
Response to wow
November 19th, 2008 11:46 pm

You are taking a comment completely out of context and blowing it up beyond all proportion. He was NOT hired as a lobbyist for this cause. Your analogy to me saying I’m not a lawyer misses the point. We weren’t standing and giving our occupations. Everyone is pouncing on this guy just because you happen to know his occupation. But seriously — like you all don’t have connected people at the Center School. What was the point of parading Cynthia Nixon around last week, if not to get some attention from her celebrity status? Either way, that’s besides the point. We are all speaking up as parents. It’s a shame you have taken this debate away from families and kids and have personalized it.
Cynthia Nixon's Ego
November 19th, 2008 11:50 pm

People! PEOPLE!!! ME! ME! ME! ME!!!

(Shut up Brady.)

ME! ME! ME! MEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!
sowhat
November 19th, 2008 11:52 pm

Dear crooks and Liars - what’s the big deal hiring a lobbyist? You get the job done the way you get the job done. Whatever it takes. We won. Let’s face it Madison fought hard, and cost us time and money - and he and the Center School lost badly to professionals! Maybe next time we can get him on our side. hahahaha. Not.
Former PS 199 Parent
November 19th, 2008 11:53 pm

Everyone is losing sight of who the winners are. The children of this neighborhood who deserve a neighborhood school. My son spent 6 great years at 199 and I think that every child in this neighborhood deserves the same. And if the kids from Center School have to travel a few more blocks to get to school, I don’t have any sympathy for them. That is what middle school kids do. My son now travels to 107th and Columbus for middle school (to a school with a really diverse population) and he loves it. Calling PS 199 parents who are concerned about their kids education racist for wanting their kids to have a neighborhood school is a disgrace. Goodbye and good riddance Center School. You never added anything to the experience at 199
wowtoresponse
November 19th, 2008 11:59 pm

I’m sorry - would u ever stand in front of a group of people and say - I have no connections with a judge? Watch the video. “I am not a celebrity and I have no political connections” - from a guy who all he has is political connections. THAT IS HIS JOB. The question is ‘why did he lie?” Ok he isn’t a celebrity. Why is it personal attack if he was paid to lobby the DOE? And how do u know he wasn’t? Because he told you the truth? See ‘no Political connections’ above on videotape for his ability to tell the truth. Whatever. It is over. It is another ugly point to a completely ugly situation.
Center School hopeful
November 20th, 2008 12:11 am

I hope that the list of next year’s PS 199 kids who are expected to be accepted into Center School will be published by Uncle Matt or another on this site and sent to the DOE to be compared against the actual list. It is so obvious to PS 199 parents which kids will be accepted into Center School. It’s about the parents, really, as has been said. And when it comes to lobbyists, Center School has not one but two lobbyist types conveniently on board as parents. Interesting that both are in the incoming class of Sept. 2008. I guess Alan Madison, as usual, forgot to disclose that interesting fact.
oddlogic
November 20th, 2008 12:13 am

I don’t understand -did Cynthia Nixon say she wasn’t a celebrity? The proper analogy would be if she got up and said, ” I have no connection with make-up artists.”

This will last al of 5 minutes. The 120 Riverside people are filing an injunction as we blog. We’ll never get them out.
Cynthia Nixon's Ego
November 20th, 2008 12:23 am

MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

*pushes 5 year old kid out of the way*

MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

Look at me!
disgusted
November 20th, 2008 6:10 am

Still, no one knows how many students in their child’s class? How many more than the other schools in the city, or the district for that matter? Why is 199 entitled to relief first?

Make your case.
disgusted
November 20th, 2008 6:54 am

“– changing the subject and bringing up diversionary issues that are not germane to the issue at hand which is now, has always been, and will always be, overcrowding.” Written by Uncle Matt.

Since Uncle Matt wrote this he has done nothing but change the subject and bring up diversionary issues.

Here is your challenge again. How many students in your child’s class? How far above DOE caps, or even other district schools is that number? Why does PS 199 deserve relief first? If overcrowding is the issue, surely you know these numbers.

Can Uncle Matt, or anyone, answer those questions without mentioning the words Schwartz, Nixon, Madison, or Center?

MAKE YOUR CASE!
thecase
November 20th, 2008 7:22 am

They are rich, white and politically connected. That’s the best case any one can have,
Uncle Matt
November 20th, 2008 8:20 am

“And when it comes to lobbyists, Center School has not one but two lobbyist types conveniently on board as parents. Interesting that both are in the incoming class of Sept. 2008. I guess Alan Madison, as usual, forgot to disclose that interesting fact.”

Once again, I harp on Alan Madison because he is a little weasel as evident by his “underground” campaign to smear a PS199 prospective parent.

Center School, your PTA, you administration, your tactics and your ethics are disgraceful.

Good bye and good riddance.
Centerschooler
November 20th, 2008 9:01 am

Is Uncle Matt our lying lobbyist? Maybe he is paid to comment on these blogs as well. Any “political connections” Uncle Matt? Thank god Uncle Matt’s “Underground” campaign to smear the Center School is over. See you in the playground! I mean if you ever decide to have the courage to name yourself. Or have you on videotape!? “I have no political connections”…. wink. wink.
199PO2
November 20th, 2008 9:56 am

1) As many of you will in time find out there are few choices for good middle schools thus any parent who does not apply to Center School is doing their child a dis-service. This is one of the few outstanding middle schools. Further, has it occured to you that the people that “get in” are also those that are community, not selfishly, minded. Therefore make the list of those who you think would get it~ I for one would be proud if my children grew up like their parents with integrity and interest in their community and education, not just themselves. 2) So many of you on this blog do not have your facts right. Please check them before you post~ knowledge is strength. 3) I find it funny that the PAC committe was vehemently opposed to re-zoning and capping until it worked for them. Stand for something dont waiver. I have personally stood for a smaller school at PS 199, protecting a top middle school and helping build a new top flight elementary school in this district. Win or lose I have not waivered with the whims of the DOE, CEC or anyone else. 4) Grow-up. Why you find it necessary to bring Elaine and her relations into this conversation is beyond me. She is an outstanding educator. If your parent was the target of pettiness would you not defend them? Would your spouse sit back and let it happen? Maybe you married into the wrong family. 5) If you are a newer parent to PS 199 you are fighting for something that is hard to understand. You see the school through the eyes of your k-1st graders. You see a playground full but to you not bursting because you do not know better. It is bursting. My older child tells me continuously that the halls are now too crowded, it takes them too long to get to class and my child was stunned to learn that library time was cut entirely to make room for the K class. My yonger child talks about crowded recess, cut library time and has told me several stories about a chaotic recess period. This will undoubtedly be made worse. CS did not use our library, cafeteria or other shared facilities on a regular basis. This is not a healthy environement for children to learn. But, you will not realize this until your kids hit 3rd and 4th grade and tests begin and school starts to count in earnest. Be careful what you have wished for.
Uncle Matt
November 20th, 2008 10:05 am

“Is Uncle Matt our lying lobbyist? Maybe he is paid to comment on these blogs as well. Any “political connections” Uncle Matt? Thank god Uncle Matt’s “Underground” campaign to smear the Center School is over. See you in the playground! I mean if you ever decide to have the courage to name yourself. Or have you on videotape!? “I have no political connections”…. wink. wink.”

Actually I am a rich affluent white person who is conquering Center School as my first step towards world domination. Wink Wink.

I take your “see you on the playground” comment as a physical threat to me. No surprise. These have been recurring tactics of Center School parents, such as those I mentioned earlier. Thank you for sharing in writing for all the world to see. And I hope I do get to one day reveal myself to you. But until then, I will not put my family at risk of harm from you goons.
fascinated
November 20th, 2008 11:01 am

For those demanding to know class size at 199 (and I agree, it’s a good thing to have a sense of ) please remember that there’s more to overcrowding than just too many kids in a class. It’s about how many classes there are and what happens to a school when rooms that formerly went to “extras” (how I HATE that word!) like art, music, technology lab, libraries and gyms now are turned into classroom space. A headcount alone doesn’t tell you what you need to know. It’s about how a particular population fits into and makes optimal use of the space it inhabits.
Curious
November 20th, 2008 11:19 am

Did the school hire a lobbyist or the PAC?
Uncle Matt
November 20th, 2008 11:24 am

“Did the school hire a lobbyist or the PAC?”

Neither. No lobbyist was hired. I am pretty sure of that.
Response to Everyone
November 20th, 2008 11:54 am

I happen to know that NO ONE hired a lobbyist here. But what’s all this outrage for? It’s not like Elaine Schwartz hasn’t been lobbying and meeting with Joel Klein and all elected officials. There are two very real sides to this controversy.
Future 199 Parent
November 20th, 2008 12:04 pm

No one hired anyone. Shuffler is a prospective 199 parent.
Future 199 Parent
November 20th, 2008 12:04 pm

So what’s the word? Will Center and/or the Riverside Blvd folks actually sue? I can’t see a basis for an injunction here.
Curious
November 20th, 2008 12:07 pm

No outrage just curious.
Come on be fair - there is a big difference between the principal and parents lobbying and a hired lobbyist who is hiding “political connections.”
The 199 PTA/PAC lobbied/as did the principal just as hard as the Center School did. AND THAT IS FINE FOR BOTH OF THEM.

“Pretty sure”… well that says it all.
And again - no outrage - just curious.
Response to Future 199 parent
November 20th, 2008 12:09 pm

No basis for an injunction, and I’m not sure they even have standing to sue. They can appeal the resolution by administrative means, but beyond that they may be at a loss. Talk about sour grapes. The 120 RSB folks I undertand better b/c they were not even notified about this until a few days ago, and had no opportunity to speak. Also, they are one of 2 or 3 bldgs sent to 191, while the rest of the rezoning is to 87, a significantly better school. I’d complain too if I were them.
Response to Curious
November 20th, 2008 12:11 pm

To Curious: Again, NOBODY hired a lobbyist. That might be his profession, but he was not hired to lobby here. We all have professions. But we all are parents, too. The individual you are talking about lives in the 199 zone and has a child that he was hoping to send to the school in 2009. Come on, everyone, be fair. We’re all parents here trying to do what’s right for our kids.
lawyertalk
November 20th, 2008 12:11 pm

Riverside is filing based on not being informed of the process until a week before. Apparently there is a process that the CEC did not follow that would put the whole thing in the trash basket. More meetings. More antics. More delay. Ugh. It is all so ugly.
curious response
November 20th, 2008 12:14 pm

I just wish it wasn’t on videotape - “I have No political connections”. It just looks bad.
Response to Curious
November 20th, 2008 12:20 pm

I agree - the line was unfortunate. But he was directly referring to the connections that Center School had with Joel Klein b/c they had just met with him. The community of prospective 199 parents did not have that political connection. This comment was really taken out of context.
Uncle Matt
November 20th, 2008 12:21 pm

“No outrage just curious.
Come on be fair - there is a big difference between the principal and parents lobbying and a hired lobbyist who is hiding “political connections.”
The 199 PTA/PAC lobbied/as did the principal just as hard as the Center School did. AND THAT IS FINE FOR BOTH OF THEM.

“Pretty sure”… well that says it all.
And again - no outrage - just curious.”

I was being facetious. I am dead sure no lobbyists were hired. You guys must be really desperate if your last public comment was to try to pain a prospective PS199 parent as a hired lobbyists. What about the 1600 signatures gathered in a week supporting the CEC resolution? You think all those folks were paid too. Get lost or get real.
Response to lawyertalk
November 20th, 2008 12:22 pm

I actually think the CEC’s process was remarkably upfront and transparent. But the folks affected by the rezoning didn’t know about it until recently.
lawyertalk
November 20th, 2008 12:33 pm

Those people at Riverside are behind the 8 ball.
response to UncoolMatt
November 20th, 2008 12:48 pm

I know it is hard for you to believe but the people from the Center School no matter how the ‘prospective parents’ want to demonize them were part of our community. Especially for the parents in the older grades. We were - sadly - once neighbors. Many of us want to be sure of the methods used by our school to kick out members of our community to allow you in. The videotape in the ‘context’ of the meeting (I was there) is embarrassing.

As for the 1600 signatures - please let’s not use baby talk at this stage of the game - I saw the petition and the methods signatures were gathered - mostly fear of lower real estate values. I could get 1600 signatures in a day to put a fence around the trump building with the right phrasing and fear tactics. As you say - “get real”
Future 199 Parent
November 20th, 2008 1:05 pm

Curious about what kind of notice was due to the Riverside folks. It’s not like the rest of us in the 199 zone got an official notice when the CEC initially floated the proposal, even though we would have been affected. I can understand those who aren’t focussed on school yet being taken by surprise, but really, why are they any different than folks in the rest of the zone, many of whom were aware and mobilized to protect their interests before the CEC vote?
199 and informed
November 20th, 2008 1:14 pm

Riverside - they are screwed. and I doubt they won’t fight like heck to change things. Funny how none of the 199 PAC/PTA buildings were zoned out. Matter of fact the lines were changed between the 1st DOE proposal and the final one. Funny how things work out that way. Funny like a clown. Some of what has happened is shameful.
199 parent to be
November 20th, 2008 1:49 pm

screw ‘em. we got ours
disgusted
November 20th, 2008 2:10 pm

To fascinated and 199PO2 (who thinks CS should stay), congrats someone wants to put overcrowding in context. Yes there should be rooms for art, music, science, PE, dance. How long will 199 have those things before it grows too large again? Is the move of CS only going to buy enough time for some of the current students to finish 199? What then?

But no one will step up to the plate and say how many more kids in a class than other schools, or why 199 deserves relief before any of the others. Why not a solution that helps more than one school?

PS Uncle Matt Congrats, since you made this remark ” – changing the subject and bringing up diversionary issues that are not germane to the issue at hand which is now, has always been, and will always be, overcrowding.” You have made 15 entries, only one has made reference to overcrowding. I won’t even ask you for any numbers again, just answer one question. Why does 199 deserve relief before the other schools?
disgusted
November 20th, 2008 2:56 pm

All right, no one has stepped up to my challenge, so I will answer.

1) are there classes at 199 that are over DOE caps?

Answer 1 - not that I can find.
Answer 2 - No, but those numbers are too high and we all need smaller classes. Overcrowding is a complex issue that cannot be addressed by class sizes alone.

2) Are 199’s classes bigger than other schools in district or the city in general?

Answer 1) No, not really
Answer 2– We have a great school, and would like to be able to keep it small with workable class sizes, and still have room for special classes.

3)Why is 199 entitled to relief before other schools in the city or district?

Answer 1) Because
Answer 2) we are not, but we would like to find a solution that helps us and as many schools and children as possible for next year, and into the future. We understand that the city, state and country are in an economic crises and we all need to find creative solutions that work with what we have.

Look there 199, I’ve made most of your case there without even mentioning Alan Madison (otherwise known as the dark lord)

Well at least most of your case, except for that last question.

If you want help keeping your school small, with good class sizes and advice on how to work within the DOE to have a strong school community, there is an excellent resource in your neighborhood. Her name is Elaine Schwartz, she’s done just that for 26 years. You could ask her, or just boot her out and call her and her family names.
Pro PS199
November 20th, 2008 3:01 pm

No one is saying PS199 deserves it more or less than any other school; every school that is overcrowded deserves relief. Parents of overcrowded schools should get together as PS199 has and help make it happen. Don’t begrudge PS199 for what they have done: made sure their children are able to go to their neighborhood school.
disgusted
November 20th, 2008 3:30 pm

Don’t begrudge 199 for kicking out a middle school in a temporary fix that in the long run only makes 199 a bigger, overcrowded school?
Uncle Matt
November 20th, 2008 4:14 pm

Hey disgusted– give up. Your math is as weak as your reasing skills.

Uncoolmatt, I too witnessed the petition signing inthe lobby of my building and can tell you that without ANY discussion of real estate values, peoples initial reaction was outrage, equally among parents and non-parents.

Let’s go back to reality — Center School is being ordered to move to a bigger space that better suits its current needs but its director simply does not want to. And so a community has been divided and ample time and resources have been wasted. Thanks Center School.

UncoolbutstillwaaaaytoocoolforyouMatt
Back to the Issue
November 20th, 2008 4:32 pm

Guess the race discussion is over, thankfully. I was getting tired of being called a racist. Seems as if the ‘diversity’ rally held last night for transparent reasons by cynical CS parents who never seemed to care about being in a majority white school didn’t amount to anything. Sadly, it’s back to personal attacks…

So, let’s get back to the issue. Students, teachers and library books, are being offered a new location which is equivalent, if not better, in quality. Most children in the zone will be allowed to go their originally zoned school. Others will go to another school of equal quality, but a very small minority will be (unfairly) zoned for a far inferior school. The immediate crisis at hand will be addressed, and more work still needs to be done — to mend the community, to deal with the larger class sizes and to raise good kids.

Can we all just move along now?
disgusted
November 20th, 2008 5:47 pm

Uncle Matt, if my math is weak give me those numbers. I’ld still like to know by how many your child’s (if you have a child at 199) class is overcrowded by.
Marta H
November 20th, 2008 5:54 pm

entitlement has it’s privileges, you now have your gated community.
Marta H give it a rest
November 20th, 2008 8:06 pm

Marta, Now really…do you feel good about that comment? How is the PS 199 catchment different than many other NYC neighborhoods? Lets not for a minute pretend that the Center School is the beacon of diversity in NYC. Frankly Marta, to be perfectly honest I am so glad you are all leaving.
PS 199 parent tired of this garbage
November 20th, 2008 8:10 pm

Marta- If I was so entitled wouldn’t my children be going to Ethical Culture instead of my neighborhhod public school? WHAT PART OF THAT DON’T YOU CENTER SCHOOL PARENTS UNDERSTAND.
Your arguments border on the ridiculous and are so transparent. You guys need to chill in a big way.
To disgusted
November 20th, 2008 8:30 pm

This query continues to be asked and answered. If there are 2 classes of 5th graders BUT 7 classes of Kindergarten and 6 first grade classes it doesnt take alot of effort to see that the school has a serious problem. Overcrowding is about more than class size. ITS ABOUT SPACE TO PUT THE DAMN SEATS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! PLEASE PAY ATTENTION CS PARENTS. CALL ME A RACIST ALL YOU WANT IT DOESNT CHANGE A THING.
disgusted
November 20th, 2008 9:02 pm

I have called no one a racist. If the school is growing that fast, having the CS’s rooms is just a temporary fix. The zoning needs to be changed. Going to a neighborhood school, doesn’t mean going to the closest school. There is no physical way that every kid can go to the closest school. Anyway, If you live at 65th and Broadway, you are closer to 191, which from my understanding is less crowded. Shouldn’t you be going there? If you live on 73 and Broadway, you are closer to 199 than 87. I’ve seen people call 191 and “inferior school”. Well someone’s kids go there. But, I guess that can’t be your concern. After all, they choose to live in that catchment.
TO ALL PS 199 PARENTS FROM ANOTHER
November 20th, 2008 9:04 pm

It is time to say what we have all been thinking. Enough of Center School calling us racists..have you considered that they are in fact the racists?? We all go to a neighborhood school - we live here. I have no control who lives on W. 72 nd st or w. 67th St. But maybe the CS is so upset about moving because they don’t want to leave to their “lily white” building and move in with ‘undesireables’. if the PS 199 community is so racist, so exclusionary, so vile…why are we just hearing it now. No one seemed to mind before. If the 199 community is so horrible why is it 100% true that Cynthia Nixon requested a variance to try to go to the school.(and was denied - sour grapes?) It was ok then..but not ok now?
Scared of the likes of Uncle Matt
November 20th, 2008 10:57 pm

Again I have to say the most defensive, and the most aggresive are the scariest. Is everyone at PS 199 a racist absolutely not! However I still say the motives for wanting the center school out were not solely about space. The motives of the white stockinged, decade old suit wearing leader were not pure and it concerns me that so many fell in line. The Center School will flourish no matter where it is housed. That is not the problem, the problem is in the year 2008 something like this was able to take place.

Yes, that’s it The Center School parents are racist. Thats the best you can come up with. The saddest thing of all is I don’t think you would recognize it(racism) if it rang your door bell. I will continue to hope that will change, that the world will change and we will not continue to take steps backward like the one taken yesterday.
Former Center School Parent
November 21st, 2008 10:53 am

As someone whose child is now a senior in high school I have to comment on the “rascist” claims. Those of us who put our children in public school back in the middle 90s took a leap of faith. My kid went to a District 3 school where only 6% of the population was white. Our family faced many challenges in the course of the time at that school. But it was the right thing to do because our child learned to get along with all different types of people - not just people like us - and the school benefitted from having middle class parents (black, white, and hispanic) who demanded that the school educate our kids, not just warehouse them. The reason parents now are clamoring to get their kids into schools like PS199 is because people like us (those awful Center School parents you keep yammering about) took the chance back when it was not a sure thing that enrolling your kids in NYC public schools would be good for them. We paved the way.
And, by the way, The Center School’s willingness to move into the PS 199 building 26 years ago helped pave the way and set the environment for the successful school it is today. I have no doubt that The Center School will thrive wherever they are. But I don’t blame them for fighting to stay in their home. If someone came to you and told you you were being thrown out of your home you would fight too. So quit denigrating people for trying to hold on to what they have. And quit making things up.
fascinated
November 21st, 2008 11:30 am

Hi Former Center School parent… you know almost exactly what you wrote about Center School’s history is paralleled in Anderson’s history: It was started in 1986, housed in a very undesirable school (PS 9 wasn’t at all then what it is now) and helped to turn that school around over the past 22 years. Funny thing is though, that school seems to posess a can-do spirit that enables them to take being moved, lock, stock and barrel, in stride.

Psychologically Center is doing its own community real emotional and psychological harm by clinging to the plaster in the 199 building. Their students and teachers will be much better off if they view the move as an opportunity and in the next months summon up some optimism. It’s all in how they frame it for themselves whether or not the move is challenge which can be met or a disaster waiting to happen. Right now, I fear they’re creating a climate of doom, which is all too likely to become a self-fulfilling prophecy. Their future happiness and success lies in their own hands.
Former Center School Parent
November 21st, 2008 11:54 am

Hi fasinated - I don’t think fighting hard for your home is a bad thing. I am glad that it is no big deal for Anderson. Every community is different. But I do think that part of the hard feelings have to do with the PS 199 people who have vilified the CS and Ms. Schwartz. I daresay you might dig your heals in too if your leader, staff, parents, and students had been slandered the way CS has been. That said, I have no doubt that the CS community will adjust and do fine at PS 9. I just think it is a sad day that some (not all) PS 199 parents resort to putting posters slandering a wonderful educator like Elaine Schwartz and spreading lies about the community. Accost CS parentsand teachers in their apartment buildings and laundry rooms, taunt the students, call them thugs, etc., Uncle Matt, for whatever reason, has a personal vendetta against the CS. Behavior like his causes really hardened feelings and a very strong reaction.
fascinated
November 21st, 2008 12:09 pm

I’m really glad to hear that you feel the Center School community will make the adjustment well. I just hope that they will soon start conveying that message internally. It will make all the difference in the long run.
Enough Already
November 21st, 2008 12:22 pm

The best point made at the “rally” was that it was cold out that night. The lack of diversity at the “better” city public schools is a very serious issue, and the manipulation of that argument for a school that is moving because of space issues is wrong. Once the Center School parents handling the PR went that route they lost the sympathy of anyone truly following this story. I am bored by the antics of the core group of Center School parents holding press conferences. If they are going to file a lawsuit, go for it. Lets see what happens when they take their trumped up charges and bring them to a real venue. As for me, I am going back to following the real story these days…the downward spiral of our economy.
Former Center School Parent
November 21st, 2008 12:25 pm

I know this community very well. It is an amazing group of individuals. You could not find anyone to fight for your kids harder than Elaine Schwartz and her staff. Most people don’t like middle school kids. Most teachers don’t want to teach pre-teens. The CS teachers and Ms. Schwartz love these kids and their unique, quirky energies. And the kids thrive and continue to thrive long after they leave the school.
watching it all unfold
November 22nd, 2008 7:57 am

I used to believe the problem here were the developers - they profit by building what amounts to a new city-worth of residents without any consideration to civic needs like schools. They are surely laughing all the way to the bank. Extel and Trump are really who this anger should be aimed at.

But now I see the problem are people like Uncle Matt - wow, so much anger and revenge-lust.
Uncle Matt - you must have a great view from that PS 199 catchment apartment of yours. You see it all, you can even name names. Maybe your child did not get into Center School because he has visible signs of your personality flaws..
PS 199 parent too
November 22nd, 2008 9:21 am

who’s for outing Uncle Matt? It can be done…right on 70th street!
Uncle Matt
November 23rd, 2008 3:00 pm

Uncle Matt is only bitter about one thing– that Center SChool parents call 199 Parents racists in front of their children just so they don’t have to move their little bubble of a school.

I will say again, Center School parents are the example of how NOT to parent.

Center School parents have set the example that you should win at all costs, even if it means making false accusations of innocent people, and dividing a community.

And once again, I will never allow my children to attend a school like Center School and neither should you if you are a parent that eschews brainwashing and the herd mentality.
Response to center School parent
November 24th, 2008 9:34 am

You know what though, former Center School parent, if someone came to me and told me I can move into a bigger home just 10 blocks away, I’d jump at the chance.
Sarah Palin
November 24th, 2008 9:44 am

Hey y’all! Didya miss me? I was busy hunting moose over the weekend with the kids and that hunk husband of mine in the great state of Alaska that I love so much in order to shore up the economy and as I was riding that snowcat of mine I came up with new ways to call folks racists in order to distract everyone from the core issues.

Ah came up with a few names:

* moose-lovers
* moose-kissers
* moose-huggers
* moose-nuzzlers

At least that’s what I can read on the index cards they gave me.

So, the next time any of you are at drop-off, feel free to call any of those darn PS 199 Marxists one of those, m’kay? We can’t have them sending their kids to the local public school — after all, we’ve been in our space for 26 years. And they’re racists!

*wink*
Former Center School Parent
November 24th, 2008 1:11 pm

If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it. CS isn’t looking for a bigger space. It’s a small school. If and when you do force CS out PS 199 is going to turn into a huge elementary school and will be overcrowded in a blink of the eye. Who will you push out then? Oh and to Uncle Matt - I guess it’s ok for you to post signs with pictures of our principal calling her a dictator and to spread vicious lies and rumors about anyone and everyone connected with the CS. Anderson is looking to get larger - that’s why they want to move. CS does not. And I will remind all of you that CS has exactly 1/2 of 1 floor in the building. CS has every right to fight to remain in their present location.
Sarah Palin
November 24th, 2008 1:26 pm

That’s right former CS parent! CS ain’t broken - send those other kids that want to go to a public school somewhere else! Up here in the great state of Alaska, of which I am so proud, we shoot wolves from helicopters. You think those wolves want to be shot from larger helicopters? Of course not! They’re just fine being shot from small helicopters. That ain’t broke, either, you betcha.

So, why should we change things in the CS? Overcrowding is a myth — that’s why they call it the theory of overcrowding. Those little god-fearing kids don’t need art classrooms, or any other cluster rooms for that matter. And librarees that have no censorship are just the work of the devil, I tell ya. Stick those kids in the corridors, just like those kids at CS are learning right now, coz that’s real good, right? Wait. It must be right — it’s what’s on the index card. And, besides, those darn kids who want to go to PS from the area, who needs ‘em. 2 Kindergarten classes next year is more than enough!

Oh, and that principal of y’all is great. I want to hire her for PS 270 here in Wasilla. We’ve got plenty of space for her to fight against those socialist, education-sharing, lower 48 liberals. After the way she’s fired up that community of yours over there, might as well come up here to the great state of Alaska, of which I am so proud. We need some heat in the those cold winter months.
Response to Former Center School Parent
November 24th, 2008 1:32 pm

So let the CS retain 1/2 a floor in the new building. What’s all the fuss about? If you don’t want to expand, then don’t — keep holding your classrooms in the hallway, which by the way, is probably a fire hazard and jeapordizing the safety of your students. But if you think that’s what makes you a great school — keep at it. And what do you care if PS 199 becomes a giant school? You think anyone is buying your argument that you really care about the diversity and/or well-being of PS 199? It’s so clear this is a diversion. It’s kinda funny (albeit pathetic) how transparent you are. So, keep going. You’re doing great for your cause.
Former Center School Parent
November 24th, 2008 2:51 pm

Do you really think that getting an extra 1/2 floor is going to solve your problems? For how long? And then what? Hmm…I see. I get it - we should just shut up and go away. Diversity is not a diversion. Seriously, do you want your kids to go to all white schools? Really? Not good. How are you going to solve that problem? And, yeah, I do care about PS 199 turning into a giant school because part of what has made it a great school is that it was kept small enough so that no kid gets lost in the shuffle. Yes, it’s great to walk your kids to the local school but when the local school starts having 6-800-1,000 children being local means nothing. The kids suffer. Small schools are better for children and it’s sad that you are willing to sacrifice that. I also wonder why it’s ok to question the motives of Center School supporters and not the motives of PS 199 PAC supporters.
Uncle Matt
November 24th, 2008 2:52 pm

Hey former CS parent, I cannot take credit for that flyer. Sorry to disappoint, but I am sure I can find a way to make up for it.
Uncle Matt
November 24th, 2008 3:05 pm

“I also wonder why it’s ok to question the motives of Center School supporters and not the motives of PS 199 PAC supporters.”

Duh– cause there is nothing questionable about wanting to be kept in your zoned school. There is a lot that is questionable about Center School decrying racism and de facto segregation as an “argument” for staying put when these concepts were never contemplated by CS until it became clear that they would have to move.

And I am still waiting for a response to your mission statement which never once mentions diversity. Yet you claim it does.

You are a joke.
Former Center School Parent
November 24th, 2008 3:43 pm

Oh, please. Look at the statistics published by the NYC Dept. of Education Profiles - 2006-2007 (most recent available):
PS 199 - 67% w, 7% AA, 12% H, 13% Asian. Eligible for free lunch 10%; eligible for reduced-price lunch 6%. Center School - 52% w, 23% AA, 17% H, 8% Asian. Eligible for free lunch - 40%; eligible for reduced-price lunch 17%.

Diversity is not just about ethnicity; it’s also about economics. So at CS 57% of students are eligible for free or reduced lunch as opposed to 17% at PS 199. 48% of CS students are non-white as opposed to a 32% of PS 199. So, yeah, diversity is important and should be part of this discussion.
Future 199 Parent
November 24th, 2008 3:49 pm

But you’re assuming that having the Center School in the same building changes the diversity of 199, which it does not. From what I understand, there’s virtually no interaction between 199 kids and Center kids.
Logical ps199 parent
November 24th, 2008 3:59 pm

these are two different schools that don’t interact at all . After the center school moves, why don’t we invite some of the ps 191 students to come to school at ps 199 . Now there is another idea
granma
November 24th, 2008 4:05 pm

the neighborhood tikes should go all over town starting at the age of 4 so that the middle school can continue to creat overcrowding and a fire hazard in a local school Cant Madame Sex in the City realize that she and her elistist gals cant always have the happy ending that THEY WANT thats real life not the imaginary life on the TV screen. People are getting thrown out of their dwellings eating cat food..why doesnt she mount a cause for these people and stop feuding about a fair judgement. Take your thousand $ shoes and hit the road
Uncle Matt
November 24th, 2008 7:11 pm

Your numbers are wrong. 36% of kids at PS199 are free lunch kids. And Center School is 51% white. That is not a landslide difference over 66% whilte at PS199, as if that matters.

And don’t discount other diversity at PS199. I know several single parent and single sex parent families there. And in the 66% white, many are international families with English as a second language.

PS199 is every bit as diverse as CS so how dare you suggest otherwise. It only shows how desperate and shameless you are. I pray your kids do not pick up on your shameless, selfish, win-at-all-cost tactics.
Uncle Matt
November 24th, 2008 7:14 pm

PS– DIVERSITY HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS! CENTER SCHOOL JUST DOES NOT WANT TO MOVE SO THEY WANT OUR KIDS TO GO TO INFERIOR SCHOOLS!!!!!
StayOutOfIt
November 24th, 2008 9:54 pm

Can we talk about the comment in the DAILY NEWS Op-Ed piece that the PS 199 PTA raised $450,000 while the CS PTA did not yet the CS directly benefited from these funds via PS 199 PTA-sponsored PCB testing, a wonderful new auditorium with new piano and sound system, a freshly painted lobby…just to name a few.
To "Former Center School Parent" from current ps199 parent
November 24th, 2008 10:06 pm

“If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it. CS isn’t looking for a bigger space. It’s a small school.”Please explain why Center School should choose to be small but every other middle school is bursting at the seams? Please explain why my child would potentially not have the option of going there because the principal wants to keep it small? Well we would like to keep PS 199 small too- does it work if we just keep repeating that mantra over and over like the CS parents do?
I really think that CS parents (and the administration of CS for fostering it) should be embarrassed over this diversity issue. You act like CS replicates some school in Harlem. Get real - this is a middle school that is supposed to take kids from all over - not a catchment elementary school with a 6 block radius. Really it is time for all of us to move on from this and focus on more important things. Time for CS parents to move on - figuratively and literally.
Former Center School Parent
November 24th, 2008 11:52 pm

“PS199 is every bit as diverse as CS so how dare you suggest otherwise. It only shows how desperate and shameless you are. I pray your kids do not pick up on your shameless, selfish, win-at-all-cost tactics.” - The statistics are from the NYC Dept. of Ed website. I didn’t make them up. Those are facts. And, Matt, why oh why must you constantly question other people’s motives and their parenting of their children? I happen to disagree with you and your stand. That doesn’t make me a bad parent. I don’t question your parenting. I’m sure you are doing this in the interest of your children. So stick to the facts. I am merely pointing out facts. We’re on different sides of the issue. And, as one of those people whose kid went to what you refer to as “inferior” district 3 elementary schools and is now a senior doing very well at one of the specialized high school, perhaps you should give those “inferior” schools a chance.
Former Center School Parent
November 25th, 2008 12:22 am

“.”Please explain why Center School should choose to be small but every other middle school is bursting at the seams? Please explain why my child would potentially not have the option of going there because the principal wants to keep it small? Well we would like to keep PS 199 small too- does it work if we just keep repeating that mantra over and over like the CS parents do?”……..The Center School works well because it is small. That’s the whole point of the school - keep it small so that each kid gets the attention they need. The teachers and principal know all the kids. It’s a wholistic way of educating children. No one should want to send their kids to go to a large elementary or middle school. The Dept. of Ed should be opening more of these small schools. I want every parent to have the option to send their child to a small school. Middle school is a hard time for kids - they have a lot of issues. Small is definitely better. And I think you should fight to keep PS 199 school small. You will regret it when your school has hundreds of more students. It is a mistake. Fight to improve the schools that you think are “inferior.” Fight to hold the Dept. of Education and our elected officials accountable for not providing our kids with all the resources and infrastructure needed. There has never been a time when our elected officials and bureaucrats were willing to put the money into schools to provide our kids with what they need and deserve. There has never been a time when we all didn’t have to bring in basic supplies that should be provided by school. The success of your local school depends on the innovative way that teachers and administrators stretch the dollars they have (and put in their own money to pay for things and count on parents to try to raise extra funds - which is very difficult when your parent population doesn’t have a lot of money.) We have heard over and over again that there are budget constraints. And we know that at this moment - there are. It’s a terrible time for all of us economically. But it doesn’t matter what shape the economy is in. Because even when the economy was going gangbusters there still wasn’t enough money for the schools. (My kid was in a class of 37 4th graders). But there always seems to be money for plenty of consultants in the Dept. of Ed and for each and every standardized test they want to pile on children or for whatever new education gimmick they want to try. Meanwhile, at the school level principals, teachers and ultimately the children suffer through the shortfall. Somehow the government always can come up with money for a new sports stadium. And all sorts of tax breaks for developers and corporations. But they never have enough money to properly educate the next generation of voters. And shame on all of us for letting them continue to get away with it.
To: Former Center School Parent
November 25th, 2008 9:47 am

I appreciate your thoughtful reply. Clearly you believe what you are writing. But as an outsider don’t you see how silly it sounds that you say that CS should remain small and on the other hand you recognize the budget contraints of the City. There are not enough Middle Schools as it is. But CS doesnt want to move purely and simply becasue it doesnt want to get bigger. Within the confines of ps199 they are isolated and insulated. Spread out in bigger quarters they will be forced to accept more kids.
Also I wish someone could explain to me why CS has a sibling policy?
Former Center School Parent
November 25th, 2008 11:37 am

Thank you. I think the economic issues are just excuses though. Clearly, they find the money when they want to for other things - just not our kids. Small schools are better. That’s why the movement in high schools is to small schools. Larger schools become warehouses. That’s not good at any level. I saw what it was like when my kid was in a large elementary school. It was very tough. Until you are part of a small school community you don’t really get why it’s important to keep it that way. I can’t really explain it to you except to say I’ve seen it in action and keeping schools small works. It shouldn’t be a case of trying to make any middle school larger. The focus should be on opening more small schools. As far as sibling policy - elementary schools have sibling policies, too. And probably the other middle schools. Someone else might have a better answer for you. I can only say that I will be happy to be finished with NYC schools soon. I have no complaints about the teachers my child has had over the years (with the exception of 4th grade elementary school.) They were all wonderful and are way underpaid and all put in their own money for supplies that should be provided by their employers. After spending 5 years at an elementary school with a dreadful administration I was so relieved to find The Center School and Ms. Schwartz. It was a breath of fresh air. And my child thrived there. And my teenager’s high school principal and teachers are just as wonderful. My teenager has gotten a wonderful education in NYC public schools - but it has not been easy, especially in elementary school (because of the school’s principal and admin.) When we got to the CS it was a pleasant discovery to realize that we could focus on doing normal PTA stuff because we trusted and saw that the school was concentrating on our child’s individual education. Throughout all the years in NYC schools the most difficult task has been dealing with the bureaucracy of the city/education dept./board of ed, etc. Or whatever they want to call themselves. For years they have had a tin ear and I expect, unfortunately for those of you still negotiating the path, will continue to do so. I understand why you and others ask about CS’s size. But the goal should not be making all the schools uniform in size, etc. Because every kid is different. No one school works for every child. There are children for whom the CS is not the answer and who wouldn’t florish there. For others, Delta and Anderson or the Computer School would not be a good fit. Likewise in high school different schools are better for different kids. Every specialized school is different and appeals to different types of kids as do other excellent high schools like Bard, Beacon, Eleanor Roosevelt, etc. Kids are not widgets and unfortunately that’s how our current city administration sees them. It’s all about standardized tests, rubrics, making your bulletin board uniform, etc. For bureaucrats it’s not about turning out well-rounded individuals who can think through issues and solve problems; it’s about avoiding the No Child Left Behind failure label. Don’t get me wrong; there has to be accountability but it shouldn’t be one size fits all. We need thinkers. We need adults who will not be bamboozled by people like Sarah Palin and others (sorry, giving my politics away.) Kids who will be able to think through issues and make educated decisions. We don’t need to be raising “low information” citizens. These kids are the future adults who will staff our hospitals, run our corporations, build our bridges and other infrastructure, serve in government and make decisions that affect millions. These are the people who will be managing our generation’s end of life care - who will be making life and death decisions. So why are we letting the government get away with treating them like they are widgets? Clearly, the group of parents moving into public schools is more affluent than me. And with money comes power - so I hope that bodes well for the schools and the kids. And the assumption that parents should be listened to and the refusal to take no for the answer. Unlike middle and lower income parents who always seemed to be begging (and I include myself in that group). A healthy school system needs upper income families involved. That’s my rant for the day.
UWS public school parent
November 25th, 2008 12:17 pm

I cannot believe the tone of these comments. Actually, having been at all of those CEC meetings, it shouldn’t surprise me that it has escalated to this level. By not addressing crowding during all the years we begged them to do so, BloomKlein have steadily pitted parents against eachother. We are now all in a fight to ensure that our kids’ schools don’t lose special classroom spaces, that our classes are a manageable size (still a pipe dream), and that all neighborhood schools will one day contain strong gen ed programs full of diverse, engaged families. In the meantime, sorry Center, I love your philosophy and ideals, but your building is over-full and the neighborhood has its needs. There is space for you not far away. Hey, DOE…help District 3 out & BUILD MORE SCHOOLS!!!
Former Center School Parent
November 25th, 2008 12:47 pm

I don’t agree with moving CS but I do agree that officials have pitted parent against parent. You’re right - we did beg them to build more schools. And to me that is the operative word. Beg. Isn’t that a nice position to be in as a parent? Begging the people we elect into office to make sure our children get what they need. The people we pay are pitting us against each other for their own purposes. Nice.
parent
November 25th, 2008 12:51 pm

WE know who uncle matt is? does anybody want to know
parent
November 25th, 2008 12:52 pm

his initials are B.H.
CNN
November 25th, 2008 1:33 pm

Breaking News!

Is this really relevant to the issues at hand? Again, does this all have to be a personal vendetta, against affluent UWS’ers, or racist white people, or anonymous posters on blogs, or anyone and everyone else?

The facts are still the same. CS needs to move to another equally good (if not better) space so that kids can go to school.
bereal
November 25th, 2008 2:14 pm

I find that there are many thoughtful and insightful parents here discussing the real issue underlying this in-fighting. Except for Uncle Matt - which is why he should be outed. He has flung so many accusations that have only served to divert attention away from what we should be really fighting. The Upper West Side has always been a progressive part of the city - that stood up to bad politics, sadly, we are becoming very regressive - allowing diversity to be taken away, allowing ourselves to be convinced that the worst possible thing that could happen would be to add 4 more blocks to our walk to school. There are families who have been zoned to PS 199 that live on W 64th street - isn’t that 6 blocks from the school? So why does a nine block walk to PS 9 change the argument? If everyone would have remained open-minded about creative solutions, and why there was such heated defense of Center School - we may have avoided villianizing a school that deserves nothing but praise. We all have kids - and those of us that have kids that are older than kindergarten age have gone through our own tough times with schools - we are not belittling what it takes to educate your child properly in the city - but no one made any guarantees (maybe your realtor did??) - it takes a certain toughness and rolling with the punches that I don’t see demonstrated AT ALL with the supporters of PAC. It’s sad that they have made it their mission to oust a school - without any concern about the after-affects to education as a whole in this district
bs
November 25th, 2008 2:40 pm

IT is also VERY SAD that The Center School parents call PS199 parents “Racists” when we all know that is BULL—-!!!!!!!
hostility
November 25th, 2008 2:50 pm

Why on earth would you attempt to out someone? I could do the same thing, but I think that is so hostile and unnecessary. The school was diverse enough for Nixon when she tried to use her celebrity to get him in and it didn’t work. Suddenlt, it’s not diverse? The schools have nothing to do with eachother, unless you were or are on the PTA and are hoping that your kid has an automatic acceptance. And if diversity were the main mission, one would think that she wouldn’t send her kid to the least diverse middle school on the West side. Let’s be civil. We all know that this is about space and we shouldn’t be fighting anymore. Everyone will have apce, even center School. Hopefully they will thrive in their new space.
Former Center School Parent
November 25th, 2008 3:55 pm

I have not called anyone a rascist.
Calling Hypocrisy for what it is
November 25th, 2008 3:59 pm

Ridiculous.

Calling an entire population of folks racists because you don’t want to move isn’t acceptable. Under any circumstances. Go re-read the divisive class-warfare-ish comments the CS principal wrote months ago when this discussion started. And then the intensity only escalated. And then saying people need to roll with the punches? It makes me sick.

Don’t villify people who didn’t start this fight and are at risk of losing the ability to send their kids to a good school — as opposed to a new address. And are arguing this in a logical way, with logical reasons.

Ridiculous.

And, unfortunately, typical.
More Hypocrisy
November 25th, 2008 4:07 pm

“I have not called anyone a racist”

Perhaps not.

But by allowing your principal, your celebrity spokesperson (see the NY 1 article, the daily news article), and your fellow parents to bring race (RACE!) into a discussion of logistics, you implicitly have.

Another thought: have you stopped anyone from making these attacks? Have you called anyone on the sheer ridiculousness of this stance?

Probably not.

So, welcome to the silent herd that allows these scurrilous attacks to continue in the name of the plaster on the walls. I hope it’s worth it.
To: "parent"
November 25th, 2008 6:10 pm

FYI I have a connection at Gotham schools.org and i am going to publish your name.
SHOCKED
November 25th, 2008 11:20 pm

DONT OUT UNCLE MATT OR ANYONE ELSE FOR THAT MATTER. THIS BLOG DOES NOT REQUIRE ANYONE TO USE HIS OR HER NAME. I HAVE NOT AGREED WITH MANY OF THE COMMENTS I HAVE READ ON THIS SITE BUT WOULD NEVER CONSIDER OUTTING ANY INDIVIDUAL PERSON. THIS BLOG IS READ BY MANY PEOPLE AND NAMING SOMEONE VIOLATES THE RULES OF ENGAGEMENT. IF YOU DO NOT LIKE ANONYMOUS COMMENTS USE ANOTHER FORUM. IF YOU DO OUT HIM, I ASSUME YOU WILL SIGN YOUR NAME FOR THE REST OF US TO SEE RIGHT?. AS TO THE PERSON WITH THE CONTACT AT GS…I AM AT A LACK FOR WORDS SO GIVEN THE MATURITY OF THAT STATEMENT I WILL GO WITH THE ONLY WORD THAT COMES TO MIND…GROSS. ARE YOU GOING TO LOOK ME UP AS WELL? SIGNED: I SWORE I WASNT GOING TO WRTIE IN BUT WHO CAN BLAME ME?!!
Dear Shocked
November 26th, 2008 6:44 am

Sorry is you missed my irony. I have no connection at GothamSchools. It was a stab at the person who said that they were outing Matt and gave his initials which is outrageaous to me.
Geneva Convention
November 26th, 2008 10:03 am

Rules of engagement? Those were broken long ago when race was injected in a question of logistics.

Again, par for the course.

When there is no logical argument or reason, hysteria and silliness prevails.
Shocked
November 26th, 2008 10:47 am

Thanks for letting me know you were kidding. Sorry I missed your joke and responded so rudely. I was just so upset at the thought that someone would out Uncle Matt. Talk about trying to bully someone into silence. I respect Uncle Matt’s spirit and support his right to speak on this board anonymously. If they do continue to try to out you Uncle Matt, plenty of us out here watching will find you and do our best to make sure no one harasses you and your family at school. Isnt it sad that this an issue at all?
Uncle Matt 2 from Center School PTA
November 26th, 2008 11:23 am

What a great show on NY1 inside city hall last night on the FACTS of the issue at hand. PLAIN AND SIMPLE AND to the POINT. The issue is about OVERCROWDING and that the DOE has made a reasonable decision about what is best for the whole district 3 community for the near future
After School Special Wednesday at 3:00
November 26th, 2008 11:26 am

Hey Mean Girl: Guess what we know who you are as well. Dont you know how the episode usually ends…… the mean girl is ostracized when all the other kids realize what she is doing. Leave Uncle MAtt alone. At least he has a sense of humor.
bereal
November 26th, 2008 3:44 pm

There are plenty of PS 199 parents who have never agreed with PAC & our novice principal that the best route for education would be to expand our school and oust another. We have a brand new city worth of buildlings in our midst - and to add insult to injury - they have the “TRUMP” label. That was the start of all this…they needed their own school from the get-go. A whole new load of people who don’t share our values have descended on us. The only reason race has come into this is that as a consequence of the decision to move Center School, we have ensured that PS 199 will now be a very big very white very affluent school. And that is wrong. The city should not surrender to the homogenization that is happening all around us…It is a sad statement that the same month that we vote in our first bi-racial president, we have ousted anyone other than the people in the Trump buildings & more new development. When our school was a small one, we were able to take in children from the NCLB program - which brought more diversity to our school. Maybe next we’ll push out the special needs kids to get the space all this development demands - that’s what one potential incoming parent suggested to me - I wish I were kidding.
Sarah Palin
November 26th, 2008 4:05 pm

That’s right!!!

‘A whole load of people who don’t share our values have descended on us’

These are not real Americans. These are not real Upper West Siders! *THEY* are not like *US*.

GET THEM OUT! DON’T LET THEIR KIDS GO TO OUR SCHOOLS!!! THEY ARE DIFFERENT!!!

*wink*

Don’t forget to vote for me in 2012, y’all.
Move On
November 26th, 2008 9:56 pm

It is time to move on.
It is over. The Center School parents act like spoiled children when they dont get their way–and to top it off- one of the Center School parents is not only a lobbyist for one of the developers in question BUT has one of the largest lobbyist firms in the city and is a former reporter at the Daily News………We dont have to get any more specific …So lets move on. It would be great to model the way for the children of this community so that they dont think that having a temper tantrum is the appropriate way of dealing with something. To show leadership on this issue would be to support the democratic process and the work that the CEC did to come up with a solution and THEN work together with all of the schools in the district to ensure that more schools are built and supported for the children of NYC. The racism garbage has to stop. The name calling has to stop. The lies have to stop. Move on and let the community heal.
bereal
November 27th, 2008 8:16 am

Let’s model for our children that pushing someone out of the way is not the way to get more for yourself. 199/PAC never tried to work with Center School to address the problem - they just announced at a meeting that one option would be to move out Center School from the building. Did Katy or PAC consider speaking with Elaine first?? Maybe there would have been a team effort or even a gracious bowing out…but to learn from parents attending a meeting that ousting a respected school was being considered, I think the term they used at that point was “get rid of Center School” - that is really not forgivable. Teach your children that.
Uncle Matt
November 27th, 2008 8:43 pm

You Center School sheep are still following your sheppard I see. You may think you know who I am, but more importantly, I know who YOU are. That is more important considering Elaine picked you because of your high-powered jobs, your fat bank accounts, your political connections, your celebrity, and your willingness to do anything to get into a free private school, which is what the Center School is.

Should your leader’s admissions practices become a matter of public record, I believe your precious little school would be no more.

People who live in glass houses should not throw stones. Remember that as you keep PS199 fifth graders 35 students to a class.

Your may THINK you are more diverse, but socio-economically, you are the homogeneous District 3 illuminati. Karmically, you are not doing well by your kids with your scorched earth tactics. Calling PS199 parents racists infront of their kids!

Time to send your kids to private school where they belong. You’ll feel more comfortable there with other people of influence anyway.

Get lost.
Uncle Matt
November 27th, 2008 9:27 pm

“There are plenty of PS 199 parents who have never agreed with PAC & our novice principal that the best route for education would be to expand our school and oust another. ”

Congratulations on your kid being chosen by Elaine for Center School. What do you have to do to get your second one in??
Welcome Back Uncle Matt
November 27th, 2008 10:13 pm

Take comfort because at this point it is a matter of public record. By putting themselves into the spotlight, the Center School has also put itself on the radar of people who have never heard of the school until recently. Now everyone wants to know if it such a great school maybe I should apply for my kid. How do you get in? Answer….well we always knew the answer but now so does everyone else. See every cloud does have a silver lining! Happy Thanksgiving!
Uncle Matt for CS Principal
November 28th, 2008 3:41 pm

Since Elaine Schwartz is now going to retire — as she threatened all the CS parents if she did not get her way and was forced to move — I’m publicly nominating Uncle Matt to be the new CS school principal.

Uncle Matt: Yes You Can!

And wow - the hypocrisy - the nerve of CS parents bashing a prospective PS 199 parent because he is a NJ lobbyist (NOT hired by PS 199), when all along the CS has had a NEW YORK paid lobbyist in its midst, who used to work for Trump, and the Daily News. (No wonder Cynthia Nixon was able to get that stupid op-ed in the paper.) What other secret gems do they have in their pocket? And now it makes sense why they were bashing the 199 prospective parent so much — to divert attention from their antics. Shame, shame. Shameful.
Uncle Matt
November 28th, 2008 8:22 pm

Uncle Matt for CS Principal– I accept your nomination!

My first official deed as principal will be to expell all of Elaine Schwartz’ friends, family members, and “favors” from the school. Wait… if I did that there would be NO Center School!

What to do?! Maybe I am not your guy. But rest assured I will still be online to let the truth about Center School be known.

And as for her retirement– from your lips to Gods PLEASE!
Uncle Matt
November 28th, 2008 8:25 pm

“Take comfort because at this point it is a matter of public record. By putting themselves into the spotlight, the Center School has also put itself on the radar of people who have never heard of the school until recently. Now everyone wants to know if it such a great school maybe I should apply for my kid. How do you get in? Answer….well we always knew the answer but now so does everyone else. See every cloud does have a silver lining! Happy Thanksgiving!”

Well thank you Welcome Back Uncle Matt. It is good to be back. I had to stay away for a while because all of the Center School stupidity,lies, hypocrasy and lies were making me sick. Doctors orders.

Rest assured I am back and will continue to let the world know about the Center School’s corruption, crooked ethics, and lies.
Dear UNcle Matt
November 28th, 2008 10:01 pm

Why aren’t you taking this show on the road? Gotham News is too small time for you. Don’t you think that Mayor Bloomberg or the Chancellor should know that Elaine Schwatrz sent out a letter basically calling PS199 parents racists? I say we all send in letters calling for the immediate termination of Elaine Schwartz and put an end to her cronyism and sibling (can you imagine??) policy. Why is it allowed - in a system that you have to apply to get in - to accept siblings? Let’s bring this all to light and send letters to people who can make a difference and right this inequity.
Uncle Mattt
November 29th, 2008 5:23 pm

I just wanted to write everyone to say that recently I have started going back to therapy and realize now that many of my hostile comments were based on the fact that my children did NOT get into Center School. I felt that this was a reflection on my poor parenting. Everything I have heard about the Center School has been more than positive and I would like to take this opportunity to apologize for my ridiculous and immature postings. I hope that the Center School community can forgive my behavior.
Uncle Matt
November 29th, 2008 8:03 pm

Uncle Mattt (3 T’s),

I guess you are another Center School parent who finds the truth to be painful. I suppose when you have as much to be ashamed of as the Center School does, and someone like me tells the whole world about it, awkward feelings can surface.

Am I brutally honest? Yes. Immature? No.

Immature would be reminding you that assstain is the only word in the English language where the same consonant appears three times consecutively.
Ironic that this would have to be pointed out to, well, an assstain.

Love,

Uncle Matt (The real deal.)
Uncle Matt
November 29th, 2008 8:14 pm

By the way, here is another rich, powerful Center School parent.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kara_Walker

There are just too many famous, powerful, connected and rich Center School parents to be a coincidence.

So funny how Kara and Cynthia Nixon were chosen as the spokespeople for Center School. While Cynthia collects her multi-million dollar salary and royalties from Sex and the City and Kara’s works are displayed in the Whitney Museum, we are fighting to ensure that our kids can still go to an A public school.

I am with Dear Uncle Matt. Let’s blow this thing wide open and get the city to investigate the Center School.
bereal
November 30th, 2008 9:30 am

wow - welcome back from your trip away for Thanksgiving - your ugliness is self-perpetuating it seems - you’ve been doing this kind of thing for years…you have a warped sense of justice, but we can take solace in knowing that justice ultimately will find you (there are plenty who already id’ed you. No need to fear or feel threatened, you’ve had it coming anyway.
McCarthy
November 30th, 2008 4:11 pm

Yes, let’s investigate!!! I hear that Elaine Schwartz is a comie.
You should investigate. You might learn how to have an inclusive, effective school.

By the way, assstain is actually two words (ass stain). But no surprise you would identify with them so much Uncle Matt.
Uncle Matt
November 30th, 2008 6:19 pm

McCarthy clearly did not get the joke. Hope his kids come out of Center School smarter than he is.

PS- Center School is hardly inclusive. Read above.
disgusted
November 30th, 2008 8:48 pm

Still waiting on those class size numbers so I can check my math
to disgusted
November 30th, 2008 9:14 pm

If you are a 199 parent look at your class list. It’s not that hard. and you really miss the point. The problem is next year more than this year. We need space for 7 K classes. and no, I don’t want a bigger school, but it is what it is. And 199 was intended to hold one elementary school when it was built.
disgusted
December 1st, 2008 3:12 am

Actually, I’m not missing the point. No one from 199 is willing to admit that 199 is not the most crowded school, and say why there should be a solution that only helps 199 (at the expense of another school). And, if overcrowding is as going to be as bad as forecasted, how is gaining the extra space more that a temporary fix? By the way, there are a lot of school buildings (intended for only one school) that house two or three schools in them.

If the problem for you is only next year, and only 199, then I guess this is the fix for you.
Dear Disguted
December 1st, 2008 7:56 am

A simple Question: please explain how - if the CS stays - that HELPS our overcrowding situation?
disgusted
December 1st, 2008 9:34 am

A complex answer: Without a district wide change in zoning, there will come a time when the physical space of 199 will be too small. So, at some point, the school will have to put a cap on new students. The Center School leaving doesn’t change that. So, do you want to wait a couple of years down the line until 199 has become 800 students, or address that issue now?

How CS staying helps: fewer students in the playground, and fewer students in the cafeteria for a start.

When Elaine Schwartz and CS are gone, and you have to turn away those “neighborhood” kids, who are you going to blame? You will then have to look at the developers, CEC, DOE, city planners, and yourself.

A simple question for you: Why should 199 be the only school to get relief when other schools are more crowded?
to disgusted
December 1st, 2008 10:56 am

No one is saying 199 should be the ONLY school to get relief, but we have to start somewhere. You are very defensive about this. If the school needs to get capped, it will, but it doesn’t need to yet. Frankly, it is not that traumatic to move a school every 26 years. people move all the time. You need to move on. No one is happy about this, but we need to start somewhere and rezoning will not have any effect for at least 5/6 years based on numbers. Good luck. I hope you still get into Center, but I don’t know if there will be enough room after sibs get in.
disgusted
December 1st, 2008 11:37 am

If you have to start somewhere, why not the most crowded school, or better yet a plan that helps more than one school? I didn’t say schools can’t move, but it doesn’t make sense if that move is only a temporary fix for one school’s benefit. If it is not so traumatic to move, you could move to a school that is less crowded. Good luck with that, since there are a lot of schools with bigger classes and less space.
Shut up
December 1st, 2008 2:04 pm

Stop being such damn hypocrites.

None of you cared about any of these issues until your poor little kids had to move schools (OH SO TRAUMATIC), and your principal threatened you with resignation.

You don’t care now. You never did. You still don’t care.

Shut up and move on. Teach your kids how to accept democracy for what it is, and to accept loss graciously.
The End
December 2nd, 2008 7:08 am

DOE rules that the move of the Center School is official. Sorry for all the hurt feelings but it is time to move on.
Danielle Moss Lee, Ed.D.
May 15th, 2009 12:16 pm

I believe the article above represents a gross misrepresentation of my sentiments regarding the need to address pervasive segregation in District 3 schools. I was deeply disappointed by the behavior and manipulations of parents on both sides of this issue at the meeting in question. The fact is that the evening became a slogan-fest that lost track of the real issues of overcrowding facing the district and the lack of developer accountability or taxation for school capital projects. But the reality of de jure segregration throughout this district to me was a separate issue from the need to relocate The Center School. There was no evidence to suggest that their physical co-existence with P.S. 199 had any impact whatsoever on the fact that P.S. 199 is incredibly white and privileged. It seemed to me that if segregation were the real issue here, the Center School parents could have pushed P.S. 199 and a nearby elementary school that largely serves public housing students in the area, to work on a desegregation plan together. Unbeknownst to most people in that room, when I first joined the CEC I told my colleagues and the superintendent that the district should take a strong look at its limited lack of progress in reducing racial and cultural segregation in its schools. I offered to host forums and to call on my numberous colleagues in the education and nonprofit sectors to help facilitate the creation of meaningful strategies. I provided each person on the CEC with a copy of Peggy Macintosh’s groundbreaking white paper on white privilege - Unpacking the Knapsack. I introduced everyone to the work The People’s Institute - a cross-sector consulting group that hosts a series of Undoing Racism workshops around the city. My expertise in the area and enthusiasm for the need to bring lasting change were met with general indifference. If Cynthia Nixon and the head of The Center School think voting against the move was a stand for equality in district 3 I say that is a pretty naive and narrow view. Anyone who knows anything about me or my career knows that the day I tell a group of entitled self-righteous white people that we can deal with racism “later”, hell will probably have frozen over. But I guess Elaine was too busy yelling in my face to let me finish my comments. I’m alot more savvy than the above article suggests. We cannot solve this issue without real public will and reflection, or without a cross-section of parents of every background who are committed and courageous enough to do what needs to be done. Yes, we can, Cynthia…but will we?
Michael D. Markowitz, P.E.
May 15th, 2009 10:27 pm

Huzzahs to the above comment by DML.

A little Googling later, here’s the paper, “Unpacking the Knapsack”: http://www.case.edu/president/aaction/UnpackingTheKnapsack.pdf

Personally, and as the son of a former school board president who was instrumental in integrating the schools in my home town, I would most welcome a city-wide discussion of de facto segregation in New York City.

But as long as there are “zoned” elementary schools — and a reasonable expectation that each New York City child deserves a high-quality elementary school within walking distance — the long overdue public conversation on desegration must not be conflated with the current overcrowding crisis.

Shoving families around willy-nilly is neither an overcrowding solution nor a desegregation policy, even 55 years after Brown v Board of Ed. It’s just bad planning and bad public policy.

http://brownvboard.org/programs/200905anniversary.htm

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Backing her kid’s school, actress Cynthia Nixon joins UWS war

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